Troubles with my trem - Can't get it to stick!

slug · #1 02-09-2001, 10:39 AM

Hey, all--

I recently bought a JEM7BSB, and absolutely love it, except the trem doesn't want to return to original position completely. *I cleaned up the knife edges, and the posts are in decent condition. *I replaced the springs, which seemed to help a little, but it still won't stay in tune the way my RG did. *I need a little advice on this one. *If I give it a slight tug back after a dive it will hop back in tune, but I really do not want to have to do this. *I play .0010's, and that's never been a problem for any of my other guitars. *I can't think of any other really important factors, but it is early in the day and my melon isn't working correctly yet.

Thanks, as always. *You're all great help.

mg

jem7vwh · #2 02-09-2001, 11:09 AM

make sure the nut is clamped tight. *Just a little bit of clearance can be enough to mess up the tuning. *

Vaibanez · #3 02-09-2001, 07:49 PM

Make sure your springs are NOT in a V configuration.

I know some people do this and the Ibanez owners manual actually shows this. But it will cause uneven pull across the trem base that could cause the trem to not return to level.

Also, mack sure the nut hold down screws are tight. I had to do this to my DBK when I first got it. I don't feel it was my dealers fault. This is something that should be checked during the factory setup, not by a tech at a dealer.

J>

littlegreenman · #4 02-09-2001, 08:20 PM

Hmmm, I was going to suggest going in a V with the springs, all my Ibanez's are this way and I personally prefer it and have no tuning problems.
Make sure your nut is tight to the neck so it can't move. *also, make sure your neck is tight, I know that seems obvious but check it anyway.
Jeremy

swiggy · #5 02-12-2001, 12:49 PM

i have this very same problem, only my whole pitch goes up about a semitone whenever i pull up, then when i do a dive straight after it goes back in concert pitch.

help!

ps i play a vwh

maxax · #6 02-12-2001, 07:03 PM

My 2 cents here....is just make sure when you are tightening up nuts....that you don't OVER tighten them...you will break things!!! *For instance, when Floyd's first came out....before some of you guys were even born...(not that I'm that old...I got an early start)...but one of the most common problems was....you know where you tighten up the little block in the bridge, the saddle that holds the string in that little vice (if you will)....well everyone thought they had to really crank that thing down in order to hold the string in place....well a lot of people ended up breaking the little block....I'm sure people still do today....anyhow....bottom line here is that you don't have to over-tighten anything on your trem system....if it's set-up right....it's pretty easy.

megawzrd · #7 02-12-2001, 09:37 PM

I have the same exact problem with my dbk as slugs bsb. Let me know if you find a solution.

slug · #8 02-13-2001, 09:05 AM

Thank you all for the great advice!!

Here's what I found, just f.y.i., and it's not pretty!!:

Last night I took the Edge off and made a very careful and thorough inspection of the trem posts. *I soon noticed that one could actually move the post receivers in the basswood body! *The receivers (I know that's not the technical name for them, but you get the drift) had somehow been "wallered out" as my Dad would put it. *There was approximately a quarter of a millimeter possible of movement on the bridge, so every time the strings slacked it would give a little play there. *The receivers weren't glued in or anything, and this was much to my dismay. *I really could not believe I could grab hold of the posts and pull the entire assembly out with a pair of pliers. *I am purchasing some high-end wood glue and maybe some filler after work today, and I hope this will put an end to this annoying little problem.

But I do have a question for you: *Is this the way all JEM's are put together, or is this some sort of oversight on my guitar alone? *It's really got me curious, because my old RG770 never had any such problem, and is also made out of basswood. *My BSB shows no apparent signs of abuse, it's actually in great condition. *I'm just wondering how this happened!!

Thanks again, and I hope I have helped some of you!

mg

Kevan · #9 02-13-2001, 10:52 AM

Common occurance in JEM's, but it's NOT a manufacturing defect- it's Operator Error (or Setup Error). *Here's what happens:

Trem goes in, height gets set, guitar gets played. *Bad. *Why? *Because someone forgot to lock down the trem posts. *This will cause the post to ever-so-slightly move back and forth when ever the trem is used. *

Now, since the insert and post are metal, and the body is wood, guess what "gives" first? *Yup- the body. *The holes for the inserts can "oval" or "spread" if your posts aren't locked own (or if you take a hammer to the back of your trem).

If you look at your trem post from the vertical position, you'll see that there's a hole through the post. *That hole is so a 1.5mm Allen wrench can get in there and tighten the set screw. *If you don't tighten this down (as MANY dealers don't), then the posts and inserts will oval over time (depending on trem usage).

The factory ships the guitars WITHOUT these set screws locked down, so you need to set them yourself. *A good test for an "Ibanez-friendly" luthier, is to watch him setup the trem height. *If he doesn't go for that 1.5mm wrench, yank your guitar away and run out of the store like someone lit your ass on fire. *It's not pretty, but it saves your guitar from being inadvertenly damaged.

Check the tech section here on Jemsite.com. *It's the BEST tech area about OFR's and Edge trems on the entire 'net (yes- I've searched the whole web). *If you need pics or a more thorough description, let me know.

Rich · #10 02-13-2001, 11:10 AM

I quit locking down the set screws the first time I had to send somebody a set of posts because they stripped their brand new posts trying to lower the action more, must have used a monkey wrench!! Nobody, but us, seems to know the things exhist!! If I knew a perfect world, I'd move there!

slug · #11 02-13-2001, 11:23 AM

Hey--

Thanks a ton, but I did know about the post locks. *That is something I forgot to mention this morning (I wasn't awake yet). *Guess what? *The locks were loose when I got it. *Do you think my glue idea will work, though? *I really don't want to glue dowel rods into it and redrill, but I will if I have to. *I'm going to make this thing work or die trying.

Thanks again,
mg

Rich · #12 02-13-2001, 11:35 AM

Since you're actually using it to fill a gap, I would think a 24 hour Epoxy would be better, stronger at least.

**jemsite** · #13 02-13-2001, 11:44 AM

i am no luthier, but i would do as Rich said. If the hole is elongated/oval (which you have not verified) standard wood glue will be less practical, given the force on the tremolo. Theoretically you would fill then redrill for a super tight installation. Since the epoxy is stronger than any wood filler, or wood itself, this is a simple and effective fix... glen

slug · #14 02-13-2001, 12:40 PM

Man, you guys rock!!

A thousand thanks again for the info. *I just ran out from work and picked up a syringe of 2-part epoxy. *It claims to hold up to 2500lbs per square inch. *The working time is 30 minutes, it dries in 2 hours, and is set for good in 8 hours. *I'm thinking it should stand up to D'Addario .0010's. *

Incidentally, the ovalling of the bore is very minimal. *I'm really glad I checked it out when I did, as if it got much worse I may have had *to do surgery on it.

Thanks again Rich and Glen and all you other JEM nuts out there. *I'm looking forward to dive-boming this thing into oblivion and not having to check the tuning.

I'll let you all know how this turns out!!

mg

Rich · #15 02-13-2001, 01:27 PM

Return the fast drying stuff, only the long drying stuff is worth the packaging it comes in!!