Sam Harris - End of Faith

The Euphor · #1 02-07-2007, 01:40 PM

I found this today, and listened to all four parts. Total of 80 minutes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVRtD1i4WQE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoHVqN-lDSo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqNXlRMLy4E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLyaKhR7DGs

Trying not to make this a thread about religion, but I'm interested in what you think. Do you agree with this guy? Why? Why not?

Any input or thoughts about this in any respect?

Thanks.

Ferrous Lepidoptera · #2 02-07-2007, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Euphor

Trying not to make this a thread about religion,

Sam Harris, but not about religion? Good luck with that.

Not going to touch this with a 10 foot pole, not on this board.

Among prohibited topics here are:

Quote:

Politics, race, religion, nationality, or similar type of discussion/debate.

See: http://www.jemsite.com/faq.htm

The Euphor · #3 02-07-2007, 05:28 PM

Yeah, I know the rules. But I thought it would be possible to talk about him without touching this well known topic. Has anyone read his books? Is it up to discussion anywhere in the world? Or is it utopia?

I know Glen will close this if it gets to religion. I'm just curious as to how well known this man is.

Wis Redz of Silvanost · #4 02-07-2007, 10:53 PM

I for one, do not know who this guy is... Judging from your talk, perhaps a missionaire?

geddygirl · #5 02-07-2007, 11:10 PM

Prior to reading this post, the only Sam Harris that I was aware of was the one who won Star Search (don't ask)

. Anyway, I did a bit a research on this guy and listened to a bit of his speech via YouTube, and he seems like an okay kind of guy (can't help but think he's okay because he reminds me of Ben Stiller

). Just the same, I don't know how you can discuss this man without discussing religion (or lack there of), as the two go hand in hand. Sooo...because it would be inappropriate to do so, I won't comment much more than to say that I never heard of this guy before now (that's not to say that I wouldn't love to comment!).

The Euphor · #6 02-08-2007, 11:04 AM

It's possible to comment on PM.

I would have thought he was discussed in the US... I was wrong.

Rotti · #7 02-08-2007, 11:38 AM

Never heard of him.

Obfuscolios · #8 02-08-2007, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rotti

Never heard of him.

Me neither. Did a quick google and found out he's a member of the "closeminded buffoon horde". Yet another person who clearly ignores the basic tenets of science. Skepticism is a virtue. Sigh.

The Euphor · #9 02-08-2007, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obfuscolios

Yet another person who clearly ignores the basic tenets of science.

Did you check out the links? Not exactly the same impression I got.

Obfuscolios · #10 02-10-2007, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Euphor

Did you check out the links? Not exactly the same impression I got.

Impressions are relative like that. Twisting "science" to espouse beliefs is pitiful, as the herd tends to believe those who spew language articulately, no matter the stance of the orator.

Ask Mr. Hawkings, or any other 'open minded/skeptic' scientist about the non-eternal universe and they'll tell you that it's anyone's guess as to how matter came into being from nil.

So, yes, Mr. Harris is in the ranks of the 'close minded buffoon horde'. Nothing relative about it, science is like that.

The Euphor · #11 02-10-2007, 04:40 AM

Your language makes it harder for me to get what you say. So, I had to look up some words, and might have gotten the wrong idea.

Could you elaborate about the "Twisting "science" to espouse beliefs is pitiful". Purely because my English is not good enough to doubtlessly understand.

What I gather from your posts is that he's talking bad about science/scientists. I'm not able to see that link. So please help me out.

geddygirl · #12 02-11-2007, 09:07 AM

Obfuscolios: You are right in that Sam Harris is close minded...but many people of many different religions are accused of the exact same thing. For the record, I don't agree with what Sam Harris has to say (I am a Christian)...and I would never consider opening up my mind enough to take anything that he has to say even slightly serious (therefore making me close minded). Just the same, he has every right to express his beliefs (or lack there of) and if people chose to believe what he has to say because he "spews language articulately", sadly, that's their prerogative.

So...was your post intended to make 'the herds' believe that what you say is true

?

The Euphor · #13 02-11-2007, 09:55 AM

The interesting part of his speech, to me, was that there are quite a few decisions being made with religion as the only foundation - and you can't argue beliefs. Especially the part about the embryo and the fly made sense to me.

For those who know more about Mr. Harris than I do, this might be a digression, sorry about that.

Geddygirl. As a Christian, is it possible to understand why he's talking about his topics without agreeing with him?

geddygirl · #14 02-11-2007, 11:13 AM

"Geddygirl. As a Christian, is it possible to understand why he's talking about his topics without agreeing with him?"

Of course it is. Many religious beliefs don't make scientific sense...which is where faith comes into play. The most brilliant of men can't figure it all out, so why would I even attempt to try? It's all about faith.

And I'll leave it at that so this thread doesn't get locked.

Obfuscolios · #15 02-12-2007, 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by geddygirl

Obfuscolios: You are right in that Sam Harris is close minded...but many people of many different religions are accused of the exact same thing. For the record, I don't agree with what Sam Harris has to say (I am a Christian)...and I would never consider opening up my mind enough to take anything that he has to say even slightly serious (therefore making me close minded). Just the same, he has every right to express his beliefs (or lack there of) and if people chose to believe what he has to say because he "spews language articulately", sadly, that's their prerogative.

So...was your post intended to make 'the herds' believe that what you say is true

?

The message in my post was threefold. First, science requires that we remain open minded to alternative hypotheses. Hence, my mentioning of the widely accepted non-eternal universe hypothesis. Secondly, science and spirituality are not mutually exclusive, as rabid morons like Mr. Harris would like us to believe. Finally, I guess my biggest beef is the fact that all too often now we are seeing individuals using their position as "scientists" - I use the term laughably here - to foist a misleading brand of "science" upon the masses. That's why I mentioned that well spoken people spewing out "scientific evidence" seem to be extremely effective in getting the 'herd' to fall for their garbage because they, i.e. 'the herd', see it as science rather than the garbage it really is.

I wasn't questioning an individuals right to express their beliefs. On the contrary, I think that healthy discourse with differing viewpoints is absolutely necessary. That's how we learn.

In closing, I feel it extremely important to say that I'm not claiming what I say is true. I'm just abiding by the scientific method. Truth is a pretty elusive beasty and I'm constantly searching for it. Heh!

-eKim

Please PM me if you wish to continue this discussion.