Ok, so my Jem77BRMR "IS" a Jem

[Jem77BRMRowner]

I thought I'd take the conversation about the quality and validity of various Jems, as well as pricing/value into another thread, as the comments I made regarding Matt's music have generated other thoughts. Regarding my Jem77BRMR being called an RG "Jem Ripoff"; Dude, I KNOW these guitars are expensive, we all do. What I wish I knew was how much it costs Ibanez to make them, or dealer cost. I know that the top of the line series' for Ibanez is a step up from the lower lines in the food chain, but the construction is essentially the same. It takes no more work to install a Dimarzio than an IBZ pickup, bolting on a neck doesn't require any more effort for a Prestige Wizard than for a Wizard 2, etc, etc. Yes, the hardware & woods are pricier, but I assume that there's less than $500 in parts and labor into a top of the line Jem. I mean, WE pay the prices, and we keep on paying them. I think Ibanez probably sells every Jem they make because the public will pay for it. I actually think that the premium price tag actually serves mostly as a means to cause the buyers mind to justify the the very price they are paying. It's the "Well, the Jems are some of the more expensive guitars out there, and everybody's buying them for what they're selling for, So they MUST be worth it, right?" I think the high price tag makes us feel that if we're spending 2K-2.5K on a guitar, that we are getting a guitar that is four to five times better than a $500 guitar. You're getting more; A little more guitar, and ALOT more free space in your bank account. Yet here I sit, happy as a pig in s**t, playing my $2300 guitar, convinced in the end that it's all "Worth It". -Rob

[King Knall]

If you think it's worth it, it's worth it.

All Japanese Prestige guitars are built to the same standards. The prices vary due to the specs, features, and most importantly on signature guitars: the artist's name.

My 2 sen.

[jemsite]

This thread can't go far, becuase these numbers are private and tightly kept under wraps. Your post however explains exactly why JEM prices will rise, and rise and rise.

That said, I'm confident it's way less than $500 parts. I'd wager parts closer at 10-15% of the $2300 axe depending how they calculate the numbers. Even labor cost differential is marginal in creating a $2300 "jem" vs the $500 RG. Another thread recently talked about "marketing ploy" and signature models have themselves become just that as we all know, driven by customer buying habits. You willingly got "ripped off" because you felt comfortable buying a more limited availability, "upscale" axe and felt it was special and not a "ripoff". Financially the cost is irrelevant to you. As they say... it takes two to tango ... glen

[HDS]

Its just like Designer clothing, your paying for the name not what its made of or how much it cost to make. Being trendy is the name of the game. When you really look at it from a logical point of view its really stupied but it also dont just apply to Jem guitars, houses, cars, tv etc.. I could go on and on.

Do you know alot of marketing is based on fooling the public, like for instance Clorox bleach also make that lower end no name bleach sold by Publix, Kroger etc.. Back in the early 90’s a cigarette company I think it was Basic or GPC stop selling their one brand of smokes when people found out they really were Marlbros but being sold for cheaper price. Happens everywhere. Screwing the public has become a form of art but when dealing with name brands its like shooting fish in a barrel.

[EL-CeeDee]

I do agree prices are getting out of hand.

And I do agree it's a marketing ploy, as well as a reality we all accept.

As long as ibanez is making more money in total ( no matter how many, or how little JEM's are sold )from the JEM guitars, they don't care about prices.

Plus, if you raise prices a little every year,.... it starts to add up after years of production as in the JEM's case.

Plus, if it would always stay the same price, it might lose it's appeal to some.

There ibanez, I stuck up for you. Now give me that slick, tasty, sexy, nasty, VWH

[b3n]

Originally Posted by Jem77BRMRowner

Yet here I sit, happy as a pig in s**t, playing my $2300 guitar, convinced in the end that it's all "Worth It". -Rob

That's the spirit. If you love it it's worth it.

I guess the question raised is exactly WHY you love it. Do you love it for just being great or because it's a $2300 Jem?

[kennydoe]

As well as countless other Jem vs. J-Custom threads, this one has been going on the last few days http://www.jemsite.com/forums/showth...7&page=1&pp=20

Anyone willing to buy a Jem should consider the J-Custom option first. They are comparable in price, but superior in quality. Steve Vai (and Joe Despagni?) gets a check from Ibanez everytime they sell a Jem. This money is better spent at the factory on better parts & labor.

To know Ibanez's cost isn't anyone's business. If you know how much things cost in parts, you'd never buy anything again. You're paying for labor and you're paying for R&D. You're paying the salaries of the execs, you're paying the rest/mortgage on the factory building. And in a 'signature model' case, you're paying the artist who's 'signature' is on it. yeah, there may be $400 worth of parts in a $1200 guitar...but how much was the machine they used to cut the body out? how much did they pay the person who put it all together?

Look at the pharmeceutical industry...the actual cost to make the pill itself is pennies, yet the cost to the consumer can be hundreds.

It's not appropriate to question the prices...Ibanez has the right to charge what they charge to cover their expenses and make a profit. It's your choice to pay it or not pay it.

~K

[shredfreak]

Well I was just playing american deluxe Fender strat at local music shop and it was 1500e and in USA I see them costing 1000$ so it's a hugh difference and where you buy it might increase the price as well. I think I might pay 1500euros of that Fender american deluxe Strat but if I can get it much cheaper I will buy the cheaper one, especially when my dad is going to USA he is probably going to buy me one. I think that guitar is deffinetly worth it but about Jems... hmm, I guess Mr. Vai gets something too so that is one of the reasons why it's so expensive. But Jem is great guitar but then there is Charvel EVH art series and I believe they are not worth it!

[jemsite]

FYI - despagni gets zilch as far as i know.

Originally Posted by kennydoe

To know Ibanez's cost isn't anyone's business. If you know how much things cost in parts, you'd never buy anything again. You're paying for labor and you're paying for R&D. You're paying the salaries of the execs, you're paying the rest/mortgage on the factory building. And in a 'signature model' case, you're paying the artist who's 'signature' is on it. yeah, there may be $400 worth of parts in a $1200 guitar...but how much was the machine they used to cut the body out? how much did they pay the person who put it all together?

Look at the pharmeceutical industry...the actual cost to make the pill itself is pennies, yet the cost to the consumer can be hundreds.

and the pill itself nets hundreds of millions of dollars of corporate before the eventual product injury lawsuit

Kenny, the same parts milling out the $500 RG build the JEM so your R&D, and other stuff you're talking about is greatly inflated. Materials for J-Custom are nothing special either, nor is the quality of build.

It certainly is appropriate to question costs and where your $$$ is being reinvested into your next guitar or into these corporate profits.

YMMV... glen

[fettouhi]

Originally Posted by jemsite

FYI - despagni gets zilch as far as i know.

Would seem strange that he would get anything .

Regards

André

[kennydoe]

Originally Posted by fettouhi

Would seem strange that he would get anything .

Regards

André

All of Joe's guitars have the Jem name on them. It's his company name, he owns it. I didn't know if Ibz bought him out of it or if there was a piece. It wouldn't be that strange....if maybe he had a better business manager

You can tell me that the it's the same mill that cuts all the bodies, but you can't tell me that the materials aren't better. I've owned a lot of Ibz's...the JC i own is vastly superior.

regarding the profit in a private company...it's all up to the consumer whether they buy the product or not. Customer A can say 'this looks like $200 worth of parts on a $1000 guitar' and decide that the value isn't there, where Customer B 'i love this guitar...I'm going to buy it'. Aprivate company can charge whatever the market will bear and they don't have to explain anything.

Do you think a Rolex watch has thousands and thousands of dollars worth of parts in it? Hell no. Have you been to the eyeglass store lately? Gucci frames sell everyday for $400. It's about 40 cents worth of metal and/or plastic. I sure as hell wouldn't buy it when there are other options that are less than half the price. Others, who care about the name brand and the prestige or Rolex or Gucci would. These companies have been around a long time. They're not crooked in the way that oil companies and pharmaceuticals are insofar as public money being at stake.

If you like the stuff that Ibz makes, it's worth more to you and they can charge what they want. If they overcharge, people won't buy and they'll lose money and go out of business.

What the hell was the point of this post? I have to stop doing this so late at night. i give up.

~K

[Rodney James]

I don't believe the BRM is a rip off!

Dissapointing ,yes, to some of us anyway, the Jem's set a standurd to be one of the most detailed and killer looking, sounding & playing guitars for a good price, now days much of that is lost.

Yet, the BRM is very cool, just the typical like any other guitar Dot inlays, I find real boring, I mean even the DBK had more interesting Inlays. They at least could of done, Mirror Dots, come on, hello somebody!

[fettouhi]

Originally Posted by kennydoe

All of Joe's guitars have the Jem name on them. It's his company name, he owns it. I didn't know if Ibz bought him out of it or if there was a piece. It wouldn't be that strange....if maybe he had a better business manager

You can tell me that the it's the same mill that cuts all the bodies, but you can't tell me that the materials aren't better. I've owned a lot of Ibz's...the JC i own is vastly superior.

regarding the profit in a private company...it's all up to the consumer whether they buy the product or not. Customer A can say 'this looks like $200 worth of parts on a $1000 guitar' and decide that the value isn't there, where Customer B 'i love this guitar...I'm going to buy it'. Aprivate company can charge whatever the market will bear and they don't have to explain anything.

Do you think a Rolex watch has thousands and thousands of dollars worth of parts in it? Hell no. Have you been to the eyeglass store lately? Gucci frames sell everyday for $400. It's about 40 cents worth of metal and/or plastic. I sure as hell wouldn't buy it when there are other options that are less than half the price. Others, who care about the name brand and the prestige or Rolex or Gucci would. These companies have been around a long time. They're not crooked in the way that oil companies and pharmaceuticals are insofar as public money being at stake.

If you like the stuff that Ibz makes, it's worth more to you and they can charge what they want. If they overcharge, people won't buy and they'll lose money and go out of business.

What the hell was the point of this post? I have to stop doing this so late at night. i give up.

~K

I thought that Ibanez bought the name from him and that was the end of it and that's he doesn't get any check from Ibanez.

Regards

André

[kennydoe]

Originally Posted by fettouhi

I thought that Ibanez bought the name from him and that was the end of it and that's he doesn't get any check from Ibanez.

Regards

André

I am not arguing this point. I'm sure Joe would be living a lot better than he's living if he was getting a piece of every Jem.
~K

[fettouhi]

Originally Posted by kennydoe

I am not arguing this point. I'm sure Joe would be living a lot better than he's living if he was getting a piece of every Jem.
~K

Neither am I .

Regards

André