7 string guitars out of style?

[Sephiroth000]

Originally Posted by Jim Soloway

I hate to be blunt, but I think that's ridiculous. There are hundreds of thousands of guitars made every year with a Floyd style trem. I doubt if there are 2000 people seriously playing 7 strings on the entire planet, all makes, styles and all tunings combined.

While I feel your analogy to prove the importence of OFR vs. 7 is not as significant as " the Euphor" makes it sound; I do however feel that there are much more than 2000 serious 7 string players.
2000 in the USA , I'd say it might be close. But not worldwide. I would make the venture to say that the ratio to 6 string players to 7 string players is 35:1. That a hell of a lot more than just 2000..
If you take into account how many 6 string players also own a 7 string but do not use it as a primary guitar I would guess 25:1.
I'm taking into account the bedroom warror to the professional musician.

[Jim Soloway]

Originally Posted by The Euphor

And?

How many 7 string guitars are made every year? How many are seriously playing a Floyd style trem? Sorry, I don't see your point.

My point was that the OFR opened up a whole new world for many guitarists. The same goes for the 7s. That's why they are important.

My point is that the Floyd style trem changed the nature of mainstream guitar while the 7 string has produced an obscure insturment for a handful of enthusiasts. Most of the noticable contributions of the 7 string could have been done just as easily on a down tuned 6 string or a baritone.

[The Euphor]

Originally Posted by Jim Soloway

My point is that the Floyd style trem changed the nature of mainstream guitar while the 7 string has produced an obscure instrument for a handful of enthusiasts. Most of the noticable contributions of the 7 string could have been done just as easily on a down tuned 6 string or a baritone.

Sorry if my interpretation is way off.
Do you mean to say that mainstream music isn't affected by 7 string guitars? Not many of the nu-metal players need a 7, but still they use it. The same way most players in the 80s didn't need a Floyd, they could have done the same with a floating Fender style trem. But the fact that they used it was of course good for the development and research made. Same thing with the 7, IMO.

I think I see the OFR the same way you see the 7. I respect your view, of course, but I'm not able to see the difference as clearly as you. I should get my glasses.

[The Dark Wolf]

I get exactly what you're saying, Euphor. Jim's saying the effects of Floyd vs. 7's more from a real-world perspective... what is the MEASUREABLE impact. But you're thinking from a more theorectical standpoint (Which I agree with), ie., what are the POSSIBILITIES of the 7, musically, as compared to the possibilities of the Floyd, musically.

I totally agree in that respect. Maybe it hasn't had the same impact, but it's just as important in a conceptual sense.

And for Beastoflove... guess what? That sort of thing doesn't sell at ALL anymore. Do some research on Korn, Limp Bizkit, or any of the "Nu-Metal" bands' album sales recently (2003+). DISMAL. Everything seems to be in some measure retro 80's now, or hip-hop.

And Sephiroth... The Mushroomhead album sucks? Oh well, to each their own. Personally, I love it. I think those guys are great (and they use 7's ).

[Jim Soloway]

Originally Posted by Wordwolf

I get exactly what you're saying, Euphor. Jim's saying the effects of Floyd vs. 7's more from a real-world perspective... what is the MEASUREABLE impact. But you're thinking from a more theorectical standpoint (Which I agree with), ie., what are the POSSIBILITIES of the 7, musically, as compared to the possibilities of the Floyd, musically.

I totally agree in that respect. Maybe it hasn't had the same impact, but it's just as important in a conceptual sense.

Thank you. That's exactly what I'm trying to say. Obviously I think that 7-strings have an enormous potential. It's pretty much all I've been playing for the last 6 or 7 years. The problem is that for the most part the vast potential of the the 7-string remains untapped because of the resistance of the guitar community at large. Guitar players tend to be incredibly stubborn and reactionary. Convincing them that something can give them the power to be more creative is infinitely harder than selling them something that simply makes them look good.

[The Euphor]

Ah! Point taken! And I totally agree.

It's a good thing the Net can provide very useful information for those who really wants to explore and make use of the 7s potential. As seen on the 7th Heaven Ibanez video, 7s can be used to make something good sound better (Jerry Sims) or it can be used to look good.

[Drew]

Seven's have solidified in the music world, IMO. There are still bands out there using them for metal- Ra is a great fairly recent example, thanks TwoHands- but it's no longer solely about the low register, but rather about the extended range.

Elsewhere, if you look at the extreme leading edge of the "shred" movement, you'll see that it's generally marked by linear (as opposed to horizontal "box") scale patterns, wide interval stretches, moderate harmonic and rhythmic complexity... and seven string guitars. Rusty Cooley, Francesco what's-his=-name (drawing a blank, sorry), Marcel Cohen, et al- these guys are using the seven string guitar in conjunction with three, four, five, or even six or seven note-per-string scale patterns to greatly increase the practical melodic range of their soloing.

And take a look at the jazz world- they're still not common, but I think Jim can attest to the potential for expanded chord voiceings.

I don't think sevens will ever become as prevalent as six's. Nor do I think you can play everything you can on a seven that you can on a six (any doubters, try and nail the "castles made of sand" intro cleanly- it's absurdly hard to fret those sliding chords correctly on a 7). But, I think that a seventh string lends itself perfectly to a wide range of applications, and that there are going to be guitarists out there who will continue to use them for that purpose.

I think my experience of last weekend is pretty indicative here- I took the week off work and went back out to the Berkshires to visit my family. Thursday night, I went down to this bar in the area where I'd been sitting in with this blues rock band down there- some originals, some stones covers, a bit of grateful dead, the allman brothers, whatever- with my current setup (7620 into a Nomad 45) to jam with these guys. Now, keep in mind that, aside from me, the median age on the stage here is probably forty, maybe a little higher. I plug in my amp and footswitch, let the tubes start warming up, and uncase my guitar. One of the guys looks over.

"Hey Drew, you play a seven string, don't you?"
"Yeah."
"Cool."

I think guitarists make a much bigger deal about the number of strings on their guitars than some of the other guys we play with- for the rest of these guys, it didn't matter that I was playing a 7-string gutiar with as pointy headstock. All that mattered was the guitar and amp sounded great, and the stuff I was playing sounded great and added to the music.

I mean, I hate to be the one to say it, but they're all just tools, right? How many guys do you know who brag about the number of teeth on their saw? do guys who use screwdrivers with interchangeable bits not talk to guys who prefer individual drivers? It's all semantics. I just happen to like the feel of my seven, and the only people who have ever given me a hard time about playing one was other guitarists.

Yeah, that got unrelated, huh?

-D

[jemaholic]

I've been playing 6 strings for 34 years and last year dipped into the realm of 7's when a friend came over and played along to the first 3 or 4 tunes on Passion & Warfare straight.

I immediately saw the value of the additional range on the guitar and proceded to buy one.

I think there will always be a small market for them- and hopefully they will be associated with better-than-average players.

I still love my 6 strings too.

[Jim Soloway]

Originally Posted by jemaholic

I've been playing 6 strings for 34 years and last year dipped into the realm of 7's when a friend came over and played along to the first 3 or 4 tunes on Passion & Warfare straight.

I immediately saw the value of the additional range on the guitar and proceded to buy one.

I think there will always be a small market for them- and hopefully they will be associated with better-than-average players.

I still love my 6 strings too.

I think it's almost a given that the less popular they are, the more accomplished the players are likely to be since there would be no fad driving sales.

[The Dark Wolf]

Originally Posted by Jim Soloway

I think it's almost a given that the less popular they are, the more accomplished the players are likely to be since there would be no fad driving sales.

That's a good point. I mean, how many sorry lute players do you hear?

[Polaris20]

I don't want to be a 7 string player. I want to be a guitar player. I have 3 6 stringers, a 12 string, and finally after the fall term when I graduate, I will have a 7 string.

I also would like to get a baritone next year at some point.

I think they all have their advantages, and I wouldn't want to get segmented into any area.

[guitarkatana]

A baritone guitar is something I'd really like to try. To me regular 7-strings and detuned 6-strings just don't feel built for such low tunings.

[Polaris20]

Originally Posted by guitarkatana

A baritone guitar is something I'd really like to try. To me regular 7-strings and detuned 6-strings just don't feel built for such low tunings.

7's are cool because of the range, baritones are cool because of the tonality difference.

Baritone 7's are really, really cool. Too bad they are even more limited.

[Two hands31]

Originally Posted by Polaris20

I don't want to be a 7 string player. I want to be a guitar player.

Agreed. I'll never give up my 6-string. And I want to add a 12-string and a baritone to my collection as soon as I can.

[Jim Soloway]

I'm impressed by you guys who can go back and forth. I'm pretty much lost when I pick up a 6-string in standard. I end up tuning to open D and then I can be at least remotely functional.