Is This Possible/Worth It?

Two hands31 · #1 05-30-2004, 11:09 PM

I have a similar thread in the "Other Ibanez" forum, but this is for my 7-string version, and has more to it. Both projects are not going to be done any time soon by any means, in fact it'll probably be over the course of a year or two, but I want some advice before continuing so I know what kind of cash I'll need, and what is/isn't possible, and what's the easiest way to do it.

What I want is:

An extended scale (27"?) 7-string guitar
Hardtail

Piezo bridge
Synth Access
(I'm thinking Graphtech Ghost saddles to cover both this and piezo, can this be done in 7-string form?)

H-H setup (I'm thinking Duncan JB and '59?)
1 volume, 3-way switching, maybe more switching later when I decide more

Piezo Volume
Synth Volume

Mini-switches:
piezo on/off
midi on/off

3 outputs (mags, piezo, 13-pin synth)

Wish I could have a sustainer, but no one makes a 7-string sustainer anymore.

Now, what's more worth it:

Find someone who will do the mods to my Revenger-7 and build a new, longer neck, as well as add a forearm contour, and refinish matte-black?

Buy an RG-7421XL or Schecter Blackjack C-7 and add the other mods?

Full custom guitar?

(at the moment I'm leaning towards selling my Schecter and going for the Blackjack and adding the synth and piezo, as it'd be easiest)

Also, who should I get to do the mods? Or should I try doing it myself?

littlegreenman · #2 05-31-2004, 01:24 AM

Buying an already extended length guitar would be less money than a new neck and body mods to your schecter.
Speaking from the experience of currently fighting to put that exact same system into a guitar right now, find somebody who has done it a few times. The piezo midi system will run you about $600 Canadian and it requires some major routes in the back for the circuit boards and midi jack. Then it's all the wiring which even with being on the phone with graphtech I haven't gotten sorted yet

Two hands31 · #3 05-31-2004, 01:28 AM

Yea, for this one I'm seriously considering going with the Schecter Blackjack, as it's already a 26.5"-scale, and is mahogany rather than basswood, a more comfortable body shape, and great pickups.

And I'm definitely planning on getting someone else to do the installations for me. Anyone have any recommendations? (again, won't be for a long time yet, most likely)

The Dark Wolf · #4 05-31-2004, 11:36 AM

I was nuts for a VERY similar setup myself about 2 years back, Two Hands, then gave it up as too complex (I realized I didn't really need a sustainer/synth, and that my RG2027 did 99% of what I wanted anyways!

).

That being said, I will try to add some of my experiences. Like Jeremy, I'd recommend going with an already existing body. The C-7 Blackjack is probably best, as it...

A. Has the extended scale
B. Is relatively cheap (otherwise I'd say try a Soloway model

I want one)
C. Already has the pickups you want (They rock in mahogany)

With that in mind, since the C-7 is a fixed bridge, all you would need are the replacement saddles and electronics, from a hardware perspective. But, like LGM says, the routes will be the thing. Well, that and figuring out the wiring. Once you got that sorted, preferably by someone experienced with this sort of thing, you can tackle the 7 string issues.

The piezo will work fine, but the problem comes up when using the 13 pin DIN synth output. It's set up so that the string information (each INDIVIDUAL string) is sent across one of those little pins. The other pins are used for synth program info (bank up/down, volume, etc., and by the way, you'd need one more mini-switch. A momentary action ON/ON for toggling through programs. Momentary action means it doesn't stay UP, or DOWN. It reverts to neutral. It's for toggling pursposes, see?

) Well, the 13 pin DIN CAN send info for the 7-string. One of the pins isn't used... so it can handle the 7th string program info. You just need someone to wire it up... but! The synth readers aren't PROGRAMMED for a 7th string

, in other words, to handle information from 7 strings simultaneously. They only handle 6 at a time. So, you have to come up with a compromise...

1. The 7th string shares an output with another string. For instance, the high E, or the low E. Problem with this is, you can only use ONE of those strings at a time, or the synth will get 'confused.' (To me, no big issue. Just share with the high E. How often do ya play the lowest and highest string together, anyways?

)
2. Omit an output... you could just have the 7th string not send a SYNTH signal. Probably the easiest fix. You'd still have 7 strings for magnetics, and piezo, and 6 for a synth. Or, you could omit the high, if you were so inclined. I have heard that some synths have a hard time tracking real low notes, however, but its probably not too big of an issue, if one at all.

Option 2 is probably significantly easier to wire, as well. But, if it were me, I'd go for option 1 if I could get it to work. Then you'd have the full range.

Two hands31 · #5 05-31-2004, 02:52 PM

Hmm...I think I'll leave synth off of this one then and try it out on a 6-string project in the future. But definitely want piezos in there

Thanx for the advice! I think I'll be saving for a Blackjack C-7 and the mods.

Jim Soloway · #6 06-01-2004, 07:19 PM

The answer on can it be done is "Sort of". The 13 pin adapter can only handle 6 input signals at a time so what ends up happening is that you can have either the low E or the low B when you play them independently, but you can't have them both at once.

Just to follow up on what Jeremey said, the Ghost is not plug and play unless the guitar is built with the system in mind. Ours are and it was a real nuisance. I have my bridges custom milled with holes for the wires that run from the piezo saddles and I have a channel pre-cut under the bridge to run the wires to the controls. So fir a Swan, it's a plug and play operation, but without that, it's major surgery.

Two hands31 · #7 06-01-2004, 07:25 PM

Since I'd be going for a Schecter Blackjack C-7 to put a piezo system into (passing on the MIDI idea altogether for now), would I run into any trouble finding a piezo system that'll work with the Tonepros bridge on there?

Jim Soloway · #8 06-01-2004, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Two hands31

Since I'd be going for a Schecter Blackjack C-7 to put a piezo system into (passing on the MIDI idea altogether for now), would I run into any trouble finding a piezo system that'll work with the Tonepros bridge on there?

I'm pretty sure that Graphtech have saddles that are compatible with a Tone Pros bridge.

Gresh · #9 06-01-2004, 11:38 PM

What about just going with a Godin LGX model with all the trimmings and use the midi out to mangle the tunings via GR-33 or something similar...it wouldn't be a seven string, but it'd be a ton easier to get. Just a thought, but I do like the sound of your project...

Maybe give Conklin a jingle for some ideas on how to work the midi side of life with a seven string, you'd need something this side of an equity loan to get them to build it for you.

brianboros · #10 06-02-2004, 04:44 AM

I have been going through this exact same thing in my mind for a while now.

Gresh: the GR-33 won't do any altered tunings, that would be the VG-88 [VG-8 et al. etc.] But the thing rules!!

Two hands31 · #11 06-02-2004, 12:04 PM

Well, see, I'm planning on modifying my 6-string to have piezo, sustainer and synth access eventually, so that's what I'll use for synth stuff. And I'll keep my 7-string to just piezo and maybe sustainer if I ever find a 7-string one sometime down the road

The Dark Wolf · #12 06-02-2004, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Two hands31

Well, see, I'm planning on modifying my 6-string to have piezo, sustainer and synth access eventually, so that's what I'll use for synth stuff. And I'll keep my 7-string to just piezo and maybe sustainer if I ever find a 7-string one sometime down the road

Now you're thinking like me, Two Hands.