Important question about double edge guitars

Soloist · #1 05-05-2002, 03:56 PM

I absolutely love my RG2020X but I have noticed that its magnetic output level seems to be less compared to many other non DE equipped guitars. When I compared my RG2020X to my brothers RG520Q the RG2020 seems a bit quieter overall (they have the same pickups at the same height). Also there seems to be an extremely small amount (almost unnoticeable) of piezo signal mixed in with the magnetic sound. Has anyone compared the output between DE and non-DE equipped guitars and had the same experience? Are there any internal adjustments that can be made to remedy this or do any of you have any suggestions as to perhaps a problematic switch or part that could be causing the diminished output? Any input would be greatly appreciated.

ryan · #2 05-05-2002, 06:39 PM

The Ibanez pickups in the DE guitars are probably some of the best sounding stock pickups around...

But, like you said, they do offer lower output, as they use much smaller magnets than comparable DiMarzio pickups. If you pull one out, you'll be surprised at how skinny it is.

I replaced the bridge pickup in my RG-2027 with a Blaze II (out of somebody's Universe -- got it from someone here on the board). I'm much happier with the way it sounds now. Same tone as before, but at a volume more in line with my other guitars.

ryan

Soloist · #3 05-05-2002, 08:12 PM

I agree with you that the ibanez stock pickups are some of the best around. There are only a few dimarzios that I think can really beat them. I appreciate your observation and reply but the thing is that I am comparing guitars that have the same pickups (RG520QS, RG550EX, RG570). I dont know what it is but I think it has something to do with the piezo signal mixing with the magnetic and somehow its lowering the output, I dont know if that is even possible thats why I was wondering if anyone had experienced the same thing and found a solution. If there is anyone who is an expert on DE equipped guitars that could help me out with this problem that would be great.

ryan · #4 05-05-2002, 09:57 PM

I think you missed some of what I was saying.

My post was regarding the pickups that ship in the Double Edge guitars.

They are the Ibanez version of the DiMarzio Blaze II / Steve's Special pickups. (7 & 6 string version, respectively)

The pickups found in the Double Edge guitars ARE NOT in any way similar to the Ibanez V8 pickups found in the other guitars you mentioned. Those pickups have much more wire wrapped around them giving them a volume and midrange boost.

In order for Ibanez to get the DiMarzio tone, they wrapped less wire around smaller magnets, resulting in scooped midrange and decreased volume. (When pickups are your business, you get tone AND volume... that's why I use DiMarzio.)

That is the primary reason for differences in sound quality (when judging the pickups alone -- cuz the mahogany body adds a lot of cut that the basswood bodies lack) from the 2020X and the RG 5xx guitars you mentioned.

It has nothing to do with the piezo signal mixing in with the magnetics -- there's no way to get that unless you do custom wiring (or unless you bought one of the brand new ones, but then you have to select it.) And, if you did have it, it would more than likely make things LOUDER, not softer.

It's simply a matter of physics. Less wire=less volume. Less magnet=less volume. The Double Edge guitars have teeny tiny pickups compared to the ones in your other RG guitars.

I dunno how you feel about working on your stuff, but you can easily test to see what I'm saying. Take the bridge pickup out of your 570 and put it in the 2020. You'll have the volume you're missing, but (in my opinion) it won't sound anywhere near as good. Put a Steve's Special in there and you'll maintain the tone and get the volume you're looking for.

ryan

Soloist · #5 05-06-2002, 02:37 AM

I hope that this doesnt seem rude but correct me if I am wrong but the pickups that are in my RG2020X read V7 (neck) and V8(bridge), aren't they the same as the ones found in the RG520QS. I understand pickups and how they work (more windings and magnet mass=larger, stronger magnetic field, like a generator this equals more power or more signal output in this case). Also I know that body woods can have a great effect on sound as well (thats why I mainly compared the 2020 to the 520qs; both mohagany). About a year ago I sold this guitar and it was damaged during shipping, long story short the shipping company paid my claim and gave me the guitar back. It only had some cosmetic damage but after I had the finish touched up my guitar repairman told me that he took everything apart to make sure that everything was ok (due to the shock from the accident) then he reassembled it. I believe the wiring was redone at that point so the problem may have something to do with that incident. I will probably just open up the guitar and check the wiring against some wiring diagrams for DE guitars and see if everything is ok, if its not I will just have him rewire the thing. One more thing I had evolutions installed in this 2020X for awhile and they were still quieter than the V7/V8's in my RG520QS since those are nearly the highest output dimarzios and they still didn't compare to the levels of the RG520 I think it may be something other than just pu differences.

Soloist · #6 05-08-2002, 12:03 AM

I had dimarzio TZ (bridge) and AN (neck) installed in my 2020 and there is still no change in output, the pickups sound noticeably clearer but touch sensitivity and overall loudness has dropped slightly (I changed pickups in hopes of alleviating this problem and now it is a little worse). I really would like to know if there is anyone out there who is an expert on double edge series guitars that could help me at this point.