Swirl keep running when i yank it out of the water.. help!

HumanFuseBen · #1 10-24-2009, 05:41 PM

Hey guys!

i've been practicing swirling on some small scrap pieces of wood before i dip my guitar. better safe than sorry! anyway, i'm kinda getting the hang of it, and the swirl looks GREAT on the water surface. problem is, when i pull the piece out of the water, it seems to be running like crazy. most swirl vids i've seen, it looks like the paint has already set by the time the guitar is pulled out of the water. what could i be doing wrong? here's my whole process so far:

- i'm using scrap pieces of wood. i haven't been sanding them first or anything, so they're a little rough to the touch. i spray them with a few coats of white spray paint and let them set for a day or two.

- using a bucket of warm/hot water. no borax or additives.

-paints are the little clear bottles of Testors model car enamels. i have been thinning them with paint thinner to get them to float, otherwise they just sink. i have used both gloss and flat colors with the same results. i dip as soon as i pour the paints in and swirl them. i clear out as much of a spot as i can before pulling the piece back through the water.

i guess thats all. could it be the thinning that i'm doing is just too much? i'm not thinning them out super hard or anything, just about to the consistency of 2% milk, if that makes sense. should i hold the piece underwater for a while before pulling it back through? should i pull it back through the water fast or slow?

thanks guys!

nafigator · #2 10-24-2009, 07:45 PM

Wait longer before dipping, also thinner does that stuff. Try different timing and different color/thinner proportions. Scrapping wont help a lot, i suggest you cover those wood pieces with white primer - thats what you put on guitar before dip anyway. Good luck! It takes some time to master at least some kind of swirl - alike finish.

HumanFuseBen · #3 10-24-2009, 07:52 PM

hmm, alright... well, this is kinda tricky, then; if i don't use thinner, the paints sink. if i use too much, they run. damn! should i use something other than paint thinner here?

nafigator · #4 10-24-2009, 08:01 PM

Guys who have figured that all out are swirling professionals dude

I am no pro but switching thinner may help an may not help - i say it will not. You have to understand that just a few drops of lets say 3 different colors are enough to cover surface of guitar, also try to put color container as close to water as possible - so color would not drop but slide into water. Too much color in tub was my first big mistake too - it never hardened enough and always formed thick & round spots.

IbanezFreak777 · #5 10-24-2009, 09:30 PM

I have been reading that you should use room temperature water, so warm or hot water doesn't seem like the right thing to be doing...

HumanFuseBen · #6 10-24-2009, 09:55 PM

cool, i'll try some cooler water and see how that affects it!

HumanFuseBen · #7 10-25-2009, 04:21 AM

just had a thought: raising the temperature of an oil raised its viscosity and makes it more "liquidy", so to speak. if i use cold water and/or chill the paints to a slightly cooler temperature, maybe this will makes the paints run less, and possibly make them more defined in the swirl since they'll run together less... i'll let you know what happens!

IbanezFreak777 · #8 10-25-2009, 04:56 AM

heheh good luck..

I just spent a day looking for fluro paints that will work, couldn't find any, but I did finally find a tub of borax...

What brand or type of paint are you using if you dont mind me asking

Lordiesel · #9 10-25-2009, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HumanFuseBen

Hey guys!

i've been practicing swirling on some small scrap pieces of wood before i dip my guitar. better safe than sorry! anyway, i'm kinda getting the hang of it, and the swirl looks GREAT on the water surface. problem is, when i pull the piece out of the water, it seems to be running like crazy. most swirl vids i've seen, it looks like the paint has already set by the time the guitar is pulled out of the water. what could i be doing wrong? here's my whole process so far:

- i'm using scrap pieces of wood. i haven't been sanding them first or anything, so they're a little rough to the touch. i spray them with a few coats of white spray paint and let them set for a day or two.

- using a bucket of warm/hot water. no borax or additives.

-paints are the little clear bottles of Testors model car enamels. i have been thinning them with paint thinner to get them to float, otherwise they just sink. i have used both gloss and flat colors with the same results. i dip as soon as i pour the paints in and swirl them. i clear out as much of a spot as i can before pulling the piece back through the water.

i guess thats all. could it be the thinning that i'm doing is just too much? i'm not thinning them out super hard or anything, just about to the consistency of 2% milk, if that makes sense. should i hold the piece underwater for a while before pulling it back through? should i pull it back through the water fast or slow?

thanks guys!

Hey Ben

Are you using primer or white paint?

As far as I know (not a whole lot)... there is a difference b/w white paint and primer. From my understanding of the differences, using primer as the undercoat will make the paints stick... and white paint won't stick. If you're using white paint this could be the cause of the paint running.

Let me know how it goes....

Cheers
Themi

RG462 · #10 10-25-2009, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nafigator

Wait longer before dipping, also thinner does that stuff. Try different timing and different color/thinner proportions. Scrapping wont help a lot, i suggest you cover those wood pieces with white primer - thats what you put on guitar before dip anyway. Good luck! It takes some time to master at least some kind of swirl - alike finish.

BINGO

HumanFuseBen · #11 10-25-2009, 12:45 PM

hey guys!
ibanezfreak- i'm using just plain ol testors model paints. the sacred project guitar tutorial speaks against them, but i've seen a lot of people use them.

lordiesel- you know, i think i grabbed a can of spray paint instead of primer by accident. i think i'll snag some primer before i try this again.

HumanFuseBen · #12 11-01-2009, 05:14 PM

i'm going to try one test dip using COLD water in a little while. i'm going to do another using cold water and chilled paints. i'm hoping both things i'm trying will lower the viscosity of the paints and make them swirl easier and not run as much. i'll let you know what happens!

skins345669 · #13 11-01-2009, 05:19 PM

I'm thinking it's the thinner that's causing the problem. Use something to thicken the water, as it were, rather than thin the paints.

HumanFuseBen · #14 11-01-2009, 06:51 PM

Okay, i just did two test swirls using super cold water... i filled the bucket with cold water, then let ice cubes sit in it for a while. i removed the ice before adding the paints.

the results were AWESOME. i think i may be onto something here!!! the paints didn't run at all. the "bands" of color in the swirl were SUPER defined, way better than any other swirl i've done yet! i didn't thin out any of the paints at all, just poured them straight into the water. even colors that previously sank all the time, like the yellow i was using, floated no problem. yes!!! i'm going to order some humbrol paints and give it another go soon. huzzah!