Tuning Issues with my RG570

[isida.d]

This is a picture of the back of my Ibanez RG570 (Original Edge Tremolo System)



I've been told that the springs are wrong, the spring at the bottom of the picture should be straight like the others and a 5th spring should be in between the top 3 and the bottom one.

The guitar is setup with 12-56's in D tuning (DGCFAD).

The issue is, i tune up my guitar, and after every song, the tuning has rised in pitch, i've been told this is an issue with the bridge.

Anymore information needed to help me i can aquire if needed, i just dont know too much about this stuff and i need to know whats going on.

Thanks alot,

regards,

Daniel

[Dee]

It will probably be the knife edges that the bridge pivots on. They can be sharpened again, but I wouldn't advise doing it yourself unless you're good at that kinda stuff!

[sniperfrommars1]

Originally Posted by Deeswift

It will probably be the knife edges that the bridge pivots on. They can be sharpened again, but I wouldn't advise doing it yourself unless you're good at that kinda stuff!

I doubt very much its his knife edges. For a 12 gauge set of strings i would suggest using five springs ina straight in line fashion. Your tremolo will be rather stiff *it probably is already*. Im shocked you can use such a gauge on such a small neck floyd etc, i used 11's for awhile and they required 5 springs to keep in position correctly. Its more likely that your tuning issues are related to anything but your knife edges being dull.

[isida.d]

11-49's for 5 springs in a setup should be fine for DGCFAD tuning?

[sniperfrommars1]

Originally Posted by isida.d

11-49's for 5 springs in a setup should be fine for DGCFAD tuning?

Looking at your springs 4 would work, but i would suggest using five as from the looks of your pictures your remaining springs are currently in a very open position and this is possibly a direct cause of your tuning instabilitys. My question for you is, how often do you use your whammy bar? If its never you should simply block the tremolo system. Did you have this problem before you started using bigger string gauges?

[isida.d]

I bought this guitar second hand a few months ago, i got it setup initially with 12-56's because i tune down to D, i play alot of thrash metal.

I never use the bar, dont see the point honestly, dont mean that in an arogant way, i just dont think its my thing, but i stll like the feel of the RG and how they play.

Something odd is happening, i unlocked my nut, prestretched my strings how your supposed to when you first put on strings, and the tuning stays fine aslong as i dont use the whammy bar, as soon as i start dropping the bar it goes out of tune. So embarrasingly enough the initial normal tuning problem is my own fault, but it still doesnt explain why my trem isnt working and returning to pitch.

My guitar side on showing height of trem:
http://img74.imageshack.us/img74/6899/img00258qq.jpg

Ibanez Rules Photo:
http://www.ibanezrules.com/images/te...nife_edge3.jpg

A side note: i find also when i riff on any string but the low e it sounds great, but riffing on th elow e sounds muddy for some reason, could that be an issue with such chunky strings and nickel ratio? (i have a tonezone in the bridge)

[eviltwin]

The springs need to be symmetrical, with a normal set of strings the pulling force from the strings will also be even and balanced:

From D'addario website:

• string-note-inches/mm-tension
  PL013 E 0.013/0.33 12.43 kgf
  PL017 B 0.017/0.43 11.93 kgf
  XSG026 G 0.026/0.66 14.69 kgf
  XSG036 D 0.036/0.91 15.46 kgf
  XSG046 A 0.046/1.17 13.83 kgf
  XSG056 E 0.056/1.42 11.66 kgf

the last column denotes the string force (tension) as you can see it is pretty balanced, a lot of guitarist make the faulty assumption that the thicker strings will have more tension, but since their pitch is so much lower this is not the case. In fact here the middle strings have the hardest pull.

For reference, a regular set of 10s:
string-note-inches/mm-tension

• PL010 E 0.010/0.25 7.35 kgf
  PL013 B 0.013/0.33 6.98 kgf
  PL017 G 0.017/0.43 7.53 kgf
  XSG026 D 0.026/0.66 8.25 kgf
  XSG036 A 0.036/0.91 8.71 kgf
  XSG046 E 0.046/1.17 7.76 kgf

As you can see, again the High E is 7.35 the Low E 7.76, not a big difference at all.

Adding up all the tensions will give you a total of 47kgf for the 10s and 80kgf for the 13s.
Since 3 springs are ok for 10s (47/3=~16kgf) you will need five (80=5*16kgf) springs to proberly balance things.

Alternatively (and since you are detuning to D) you can use four, and screw the spring retainer in deeper. (the difference will probably be no more than 2 to 3mm)

You can easily try this, put the springs on in a straight, symmetrical, 2+2 pattern, if necessary screw the spring retainer in (evenly! a quarter twist on the bottom one, a quarter twist on the top, etc. until the high E is to tune again) If your guitar is tuned correctly now and you do this right you won't even have to retune.

So why is this causing tuning instability? The forces on the post are unbalanced, but more importantly, with one spring angled the trem will be pulled slightly sideways, causing the rounded knife edge to ride up the post.

[Ki swordsman]

Block it! problem solvered

[isida.d]

Something odd happened last night, my guitar went out of tune so i tuned up and it did what it did before before stretching. Thats very weird to me.
Originally i got it into tune and got it to stay by stretching up the strings then tuning up to pitch (This is only if i didnt use the trem, i dont use the trem anyway tho, so no big loss).

A couple of days later the guitar went out of tune for the first time in a littl ewhile and then when it une up it does the same ol "risen pitch on all strings" thing.