Wishing to swap Lo-Trs for a Stop Tailpiece, advice, help? -

ericbrowning · #1 01-20-2001, 06:03 PM

Thanks in advance for any help. *I never use my tremolo bar anymore, and even if i did it'd still be a Lo-Trs

*I want to take the whole Floyd out and put on a stop tailpiece. *I hate the time it takes to restring and accurately tune a Floyd, and it's not my lack of experience, I've had this guitar for about 3 years now. *It's an S series, 470 i would imagine, dark natural finish. *Would I be able to put a stop tailpiece on this guitar? If you have anything to say, anything at all, I'd appreciate it. Thanks

alienx · #2 01-20-2001, 06:13 PM

Well, you could fill the trem cavity with wood and put a Fender style fixed bridge which should cover the tremhole such that you will not need any paint and finishing work.
Good luck...

**jemsite** · #3 01-20-2001, 06:30 PM

I would not invest ANY money in an 470. Personally i would block the bridge for no tremolo movement. That will be just as effective, cost zero and allow full resale. See the jemsite --> guitar --> tech section... glen

DEICIDEL · #4 01-21-2001, 12:57 AM

I second that, block it!

ericbrowning · #5 01-21-2001, 02:17 AM

Thanks guys. *Ive thought about blocking the tremolo, but here's my situation: Im just a kid

and have very little money. *That guitar is my main guitar, and it's actually a good sounding and playing guitar (I replaced the stock PU's w/ Seymour Duncans, which helped quite a bit). So resell value isn't really a worry of mine. *I understand blocking the trem for no movement will alleviate the tuning problems. *I was also wondering though if a stop tailpiece would sound really unique, because theyr'ed be all of that hollow space that was carved out for the trem. *I was thinking that might sound interesting. Well I'm still thinking about it, further input always welcome.

littlegreenman · #6 01-21-2001, 03:03 AM

The big problem with filling in the cavity is it is a ton of work!!!! That and the fixed bridge won't mount properly unless it's filled in. *Then you have to redrill accurate holes, drill string holes, and refinish the guitar. *I had a Samick (ick :lame

that had a terrible bridge, here's what I did.
I cut a piece of wood that fit the trem cavity dimensions but made it tall enough to hold the trem up in the level position. *This was then just installed with double sided tape so it was easily removed if I wanted to. *By doing this, I could easily do drop D tuning or whatever but since the tailpiece was always sitting against the block, it never went sharp if you dropped (or broke) a string. *Plus I could still do a dive bomb if I wanted to. *There are downsides, I still had a big ugly chunk of wood in there, changing strings required that I used the Whammy bar to pull the trem down so I could unlock the string clamp bolts. *Of course, on the newer Ibanez trems, this isn't an issue since the bolts are on the top anyway.
Well, that was my fix for a trem that sucked (not to say your trem sucks at all, just an idea for blocking it)
Jeremy

darren wilson · #7 01-21-2001, 01:14 PM

Gluing blocks of wood into all the hollow cavities isn't going to be quite the same as if those holes had never been routed out at all.

For the amount of work it would take fitting those blocks, filling the gaps, refinishing the guitar and mounting a new stop tailpiece, i just don't think it'd be worth the effort for the sonic quality you'd get in return.

If you're strapped for cash, blocking the trem is definitely the way to go. Filling all those holes and repainting is going to cost you a pretty penny for a quality job.

ericbrowning · #8 01-21-2001, 02:13 PM

Thanks guys, I think I will just block it. *I don't think I explained my theory though, maybe its crazy, who knows

*What I was wondering is if it might sound really open and cool if I put the stop tailpiece on, not filling in the cavities, just leaving them open. *Perhaps a pseudo-hollowbody sound or something like that. Oh well, once I get another guitar in time, I might try that mod, it still intrigues me. *

darren wilson · #9 01-21-2001, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Quote: from ericbrowning on 1:13 pm on Jan. 21, 2001
What I was wondering is if it might sound really open and cool if I put the stop tailpiece on, not filling in the cavities, just leaving them open. *Perhaps a pseudo-hollowbody sound or something like that.

Hmm. Sorry to disappoint you, but i don't think your theory will work in reality, Eric.

First of all, if you remove the TRS, you'll have a big hole going all the way through the body, and a deep cavity in the rear of the guitar. If it's a recessed trem, you'll have a cavity in the top of the guitar as well. Those big holes leave nowhere to physically mount a bridge/tailpiece combo on the surface of the guitar. You have to fill the holes just so there's a place to attach a surface-mounted bridge/tailpiece into the guitar!

Second, the sound of a hollowbody doesn't come as a result of simply carving holes on the outside of a solid body. The unique hollowbody sound comes from air resonating within hollow cavities inside the guitar's body and projecting out through the soundhole(s). Removing wood from the outside of a solidbody guitar just reduces its mass and potential resonance.

If it were as simple as routing or drilling holes in a solid body to get a pseudo-hollowbody sound, you'd probably see a lot more swiss cheese guitars around.

ericbrowning · #10 01-22-2001, 06:18 PM

Sorry guys, I'm really not as stupid as I have made it seem on this thread

*I understand the principles of how a hollow or semi-hollow body gets it's resonance and tone, I just thought that the mod would sound interesting. *After your replies, I borrowed a stop tailpiece/bridge from a friend of mine who has heaps of old parts and junk. *Upon looking at it further, I realized that the only place it would fit on the guitar (without filling in the holes), would be the part at the very end of the Floyd cavity, and that would be back way to far for the strings to even stretch properly I would imagine. *I also realized that the guitar would be really top-heavy if all that metal weight of the trem was taken out, because the guitar is somewhat top-heavy now. *Well thanks anyway guys, I'll be back when I think of a more practical scheme

littlegreenman · #11 01-22-2001, 07:52 PM

If you moved the tailpiece back behind the trem cavity you'd never get it to intonate properly anyway. *
Just keep looking for a fixed bridge guitar if that's what you really want.
BTW, you don't sound stupid, just remember, the only stupid question is the one you don't ask!
Well, that one and, why do they have locks on a 24 hour store? LOL
Jeremy

darren wilson · #12 01-22-2001, 09:00 PM

Be careful not to mix up the terms "tailpiece" and "bridge". The tailpiece is where the strings get anchored. The bridge is where they break over and you set intonation.

Even if you figure out a place to mount the tailpiece without filling the holes, you still need to have a bridge on there, which would need to be mounted near the front of the trem cavity, around where the strings break over the bridge saddles on your TRS.

You can eliminate the tailpiece if you opt for a strings-through-the-body arrangement or put in one of the combined bridge/tailpiece units like on the Ibanez S-Classic or PRS guitars, but you still have the mounting problem, because they need to be situated closer to the pickups.

At any rate, i'm glad you've decided to do something more sensible. I don't think it would have been a very successful mod.

(Edited by darren wilson at 8:04 pm on Jan. 22, 2001)

Doink · #13 01-24-2001, 01:16 AM

They have locks on 24 hour stores in case of a robbery. They lock down the whole store till the cops get there. I used to work at a 24/7 (even open on Christmas) mini mart/gas station.

It would still be possible to throw on a tune-o-matic Gibson style bridge. You have to put the bridge (where the strings would arch) in where the studs are. You'll probly have to redrill and move the studs outward or inward, I think the tune-o-matic is a different width than the TRS.
That said, the S classic would be your best solution. Or if you don't want to get another guitar, blocking it off would be best.

littlegreenman · #14 01-24-2001, 01:44 AM

K, here's a couple more questions for ya Doink.
Why do people drive in parkways and park in driveways?
If nothing sticks to teflon, how does teflon stick to the pan?
What came first, the chicken or the egg?
LOL
Jeremy
Oh yeah, why lock up the store AFTER the robbery, isn't all the good stuff gone after that? *LOL *Just kidding, I wasn't actually looking for an answer, just a funny question.

(Edited by littlegreenman at 12:45 am on Jan. 24, 2001)

Doink · #15 01-25-2001, 02:03 AM

Well, if you're driving a car like mine, you often find yourself parked on the shoulder of a parkway with the hazards on.
People still drive a few feet in the driveway, they have to get in there somehow.

Teflon has a unique chemical forumula that allows it to stick to certain kinds of metals.

The chicken evolved from the chickasaurus.