Scales & Modes - Page 3

Dee · #31 02-03-2008, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martyr Machine

The way people fellate Hendrix is just irritating.

The way you fellate yourself is also, Mr High and Mighty. Thank you for your concerted effort to sound intellectual.

Martyr Machine · #32 02-03-2008, 10:16 PM

Quote:

The way you fellate yourself is also, Mr High and Mighty. Thank you for your concerted effort to sound intellectual.

I noticed that you didn't actually respond to anything I said. You make baseless statements encouraging people not to learn theory, and then refuse to respond when your argument is torn apart.

CosmicDebris · #33 02-03-2008, 10:19 PM

mi2tom · #34 02-03-2008, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmicDebris

+1!!!

Fretrunnr · #35 02-04-2008, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmicDebris

I am willing to bet you could name more guitar gods that dont know much theory than those who don't. Now I am not saying don't learn it but it isn't the be all to end all. Everyone much choose their own path.

Who wants to be a guitar god ?
I don't,I just want to play guitar.I love its sound.
Obviously there are more guitar gods with less theory cause the majority of people aren't musicians,they only care about good melodies.
If I wasn't a musician,I probably will hate more technical stuff,but if you study,you will want to listen to more well constructed music,why is that ?It's evolution,nobody wants to play pentatonics boxes for all life.......wait the majority of guitar gods do that because non musicians care only about good melodies .With pentatonics you can comunicate better to the crowd who aren't musicians.

BTW studing and learning something is ALWAYS BETTER than doing nothing.Even if you never use that stuff,learning is part of evolution,if you don't study,you are frozen in time.Just like some old people when they're next to a computer.Look their faces,they look like WTF is it ??!! hahahahaha

CosmicDebris · #36 02-04-2008, 07:56 AM

Fret, did you read the quote you quoted?

Fretrunnr · #37 02-04-2008, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmicDebris

Fret, did you read the quote you quoted?

Yup I quoted you just because of that guitar god part.My sayings were more about to all stuff said in this thread,not really about your quote.
Sorry if I sounded against you or something.Not at all.

DavyH · #38 02-04-2008, 09:01 AM

Why does this subject always end up with people all over each other like pit bulls. The facts are as follows:

1. Musical theory is not going to improve your personal playing ability to any great extent; most of the concepts are absorbed and realised through years of practice in any event.

2. What the theoretical aspect does is allow for absolute transmission of information and absolute comprehension by a similarly skilled reader/viewer/listener. To outsiders it's gobbledygook.

Some instruments require you to develop your theoretical knowledge more than others - probably 99% of guitarists have the most rudimentary concept of music theory. Since I have spent most of my life working with a transposed instrument with only 9 notes (and my theoretical and technical knowledge of that particular instrument is excellent), I find the subject of modes confuses the hell out of me - at the same time I can hear and understand the applications and differences.

In short: you can get by without wide knowledge of the underlying musical theory. Like any other kind of learning, though, broadening your knowledge can only be of benefit in the long run.

(Before I get pasted for being simplistic in the above points, read them again).

Batchimp RG · #39 02-04-2008, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dee

Not everyone who picks up a guitar is trying to be a master. Most of us do it for our own enjoyment while sitting in our bedrooms. Again, if you can get by without learning tons of theory it's all good. It all depends on what you are going for. If you want to totally master the guitar (which is impossible because we never stop learning) then yes, go ahead and absorb all the theory you can.

I agree with this BUT ------if there were parallell universes ie. Chimp RG as he is now AND Chimp RG as he is now except with more musical theory knowledge (in the parallel universe

)....I would prefer to be the latter.

Batchimp RG · #40 02-04-2008, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaden

get Doug Doppler's DVD
http://www.guitar411.com/p_diatonic.html

I was recommended this and although Doug is very likeable, I didn't like this one

For sale BTW

Batchimp RG · #41 02-04-2008, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wild_Child

All I'm saying is theory does nothing but good. No, it's not essential, but it's unbelievable to say it's not important. Anyone would be a better musician if they knew a bit more theory. If you're not interested, then fair enough! It's just a hobby after all and rule #1 is have FUN! But don't tell others who are interested that it's a waste of their time, because that's really not helping anyone.

Very well put!

rastachild · #42 02-04-2008, 07:40 PM

hmm. well i can see the merits in both sides of this debate. let me preface by stating i have a degree in music composition and went through years of theory. i can say from personal experience that it has helped me a great bit in many areas. one thing i will say that i totally agree with that wild child and martyr machine have been saying is that theory is merely a tool for analysis. davyh said it is a method of communicating, which is also very true. i don't think it will necessarily turn you into a creative genius. why not? because theory looks at all that has been done throughout the years in all forms of music (well, typically western music) and breaks it down in an almost mathematical way into it's smallest bits of information. so how can a person gain creativity from studying a bunch of music that's already been written--some by composers who were themselves bucking the theoretical system at their time? good question

i'd say if anything, after studying all of those different types of music, you start to see redundancy everywhere, including your own music. truth be told, there are no new innovations in music. no new ways to combine the 12 notes that we work with and even microtonally, that has been explored for centuries in eastern countries. it can depress you to no end if you let it, lol. all we can do is put our own signature on tried and true concepts. and that 'signature' typically comes from techniques learned/innovated through lots of practice on the instrument. lynch's vibrato, hendrix's brilliant use of effects and feedback, eddie's tapping...these are what i'm talking about.

the piece of the puzzle that i think theory heavy people miss is that there are more ways to learn than sitting in a classroom buried in a book. stumbling on a scale by learning a solo from one of your influences, for example. you may not know the name of it, but if you practice it long enough, you will know the scale. same goes for chords and progressions and just about anything else that can be gained from theory. listening to dee play (awesome, btw!), it's obvious he has a very advanced level of knowledge, even if he doesn't know the proper names for everything that he's doing.

that being said, theory can potentially get you to point a to point b quicker. but some people like taking the scenic route

and there's nothing wrong with that at all.

Martyr Machine · #43 02-05-2008, 02:12 AM

All theory does is explain why musical concepts sounds the way they do. It predicts consonance and dissonance and allows you to look at the work of another musician and determine how they did what they did. There is no conceivable reason not to learn theory. Not a single reason.

DavyH · #44 02-05-2008, 03:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rastachild

i don't think it will necessarily turn you into a creative genius.

So true. 30 years of piping and I was very good indeed. I still haven't written more than two tunes, both of which were crap. I'm a good arranger though and I can set up a pipe band faster than I can set up a Floyd equipped guitar.

Creativity? No, I'm too literally minded. That needs a spark which some have, tuition and theoretical knowledge or not.

Batchimp RG · #45 02-05-2008, 06:36 AM

I enjoyed reading your post, rastachild. You seem to have alot of wisdom on this subject.

It reminded me of my old guitar teacher that I used to go to about 13 years ago. He was a theory nut and absolutely passionate about all styles of guitar. I got in touch with him a few months ago by phone and I was shocked by what he said and how jaded he sounded

.
He said that he gets very little pleasure out of music nowadays because he can identify any chord, mode, key etc etc and his pitch was excellent. He said he couldn't appreciate music anymore because he just analysed it and "saw right through it".

I know this is an extreme case, but your post made me think of it.