Scales & Modes

aqeel80 · #1 02-03-2008, 02:42 AM

Ok,,,,, I have tried everything,, but just can't seem to learn these things,, I need advice on any good books around especially ones with scales?? each & every scale detaileddd

It's just so annoying,, been three years and am still at the same spot where i was when i started.

Obfuscolios · #2 02-03-2008, 04:17 AM

"The Guitar Grimoire - Scales and Modes" by Adam Kadmon. Get it. Read it. Practice it. Understand.
-Ekim

Jaden · #3 02-03-2008, 05:22 AM

get Doug Doppler's DVD
http://www.guitar411.com/p_diatonic.html

Eggy · #4 02-03-2008, 05:29 AM

Don't worry about it. It's been 23yrs since I started and have got no idea at all about scales and modes. I just know what shapes to play and how to stay in key.
When people say "Yes I played the Eb Lydian in the 3rd degree then moved to Gb, it's relative minor 3rd and played that in the 5th position".........

...To me they sound like that teacher out of Charlie Brown. I can hear sounds coming out of their mouths but it just doesn't mean anything.

Dee · #5 02-03-2008, 08:07 AM

^^ I'm with Ben. Been playing since 1979. Still don't know what the hell I am doing! Some people told me what scales I was using in the solo on this track but really I had no idea at all and I already forgot. I don't seem to have the ability to remember all the technical stuff.

Martyr Machine · #6 02-03-2008, 08:10 AM

The music theory guide that I was suppose to have done months ago, but still doesn't contain anything more than a modes lesson.

I need to make some revisions, but nothing is blatantly inaccurate.

Quote:

"The Guitar Grimoire - Scales and Modes" by Adam Kadmon. Get it. Read it. Practice it. Understand.
-Ekim

I disagree with this. The Grimoir books are 90% redundant information and just reinforce the idea that scales and modes are shapes without explaining the theory behind them.

mi2tom · #7 02-03-2008, 08:16 AM

[quote=Eggy;779445]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dee

this track

Totally damn good!

Jaden · #8 02-03-2008, 08:38 AM

im with Ben and Dee on this also, I bought the Doppler DVD in order to expand my knowledge from zero... its great, I still dont know what im doing but I seem to have more options.

CosmicDebris · #9 02-03-2008, 08:55 AM

I am with Eggy n' Dee.

Martyr Machine · #10 02-03-2008, 09:04 AM

If I could make expletive laden personal attacks on this forum, I would. Theory is descriptive, not prescriptive. It will not hold you back or limit you in any way. What it does do is explain why musical concepts sound the way they do, allowing you far more freedom to develop your creative ideas. There is absolutely no reason not to learn as much theory as possible.

CosmicDebris · #11 02-03-2008, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martyr Machine

There is absolutely no reason not to learn as much theory as possible.

I agree sorta. I learn a bit here and there but perfer to spend the little free time I have playing mostly.

richard1973 · #12 02-03-2008, 09:42 AM

So i'm not the only one lol I bought a book a few months ago and some of it sunk in and i understood the circle of 5ths and I could work out scales on guitar from it etc, i thought oh wow i'm picking this stuff up!

Then the next few chapters have lost me, all the modes and 5ths 'n' 7ths 'n' 9ths and a whole bunch of other stuff that causes hand to scratch head

What gets me is ok I know a bunch of scales say for example A major scale i know 3 places on the guitar for example of where it is, but all the notes between those 3 shapes also contain the same notes which are also part of the whole A major scale on the whole neck.....but its just remembering where they all are, ok its easy to work them out which they are, but when playing fast you dont have time to work it out. If everything was just played in A major then ok youd get to learn them....but if playing B major for example although its the same shape, everything gets moved down 2 frets which ok is obvious but it just adds to the confusion when playing on the spot, again you dont have time to work it out.

So thats my main issue, and thats what i want to try and solve, there must be an easy or easier way than remembering.

So for me i pretty much do what Dee does, i kinda have a feel for what goes together just from years of experience of trial and error i guess.

Dee · #13 02-03-2008, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martyr Machine

If I could make expletive laden personal attacks on this forum, I would. Theory is descriptive, not prescriptive. It will not hold you back or limit you in any way. What it does do is explain why musical concepts sound the way they do, allowing you far more freedom to develop your creative ideas. There is absolutely no reason not to learn as much theory as possible.

That's not true. I don't really feel the need to learn tons of theory because I feel I can express myself perfectly well without it. There is no right or wrong in music. Ever. Does the knowledge you have so far allow you to express yourself? If that's a yes, it's all good.

Music = an artform, and art = expression.

Q: Did Hendrix need to know tons of theory? A: No. And he's probably THE most respected guitarist who ever lived.
Q: How many chords did Marc Bolan know? A: Seven. And he was a very successful musician.

You see, it isn't vital, and you have no right to throw expletive laden attacks at anyone for not knowing or not being interested.

Musical fascism, anyone?

PS: I am interested to hear the music you have been making, Martyr Machine, and how you've put your theory to good use. I expect you to be an absolutely exceptional guitar player. Don't let me down, now.

Wild_Child · #14 02-03-2008, 01:42 PM

He didn't say it is vital. He said there's no reason not to learn it.

Music is an art, yes. But masters of any art had a basis in years of hard work. I don't think Da Vinci just decided to pick up a paintbrush one day and paint the Mona Lisa. Many of us have a little natural talent but it's barely worth a damn if you don't know how to exploit it. Technique is one thing we can work on, but without theory all you've got are some hand movements.

Unless you have a prodigal ability to play perfectly and communicate exactly what you want by ear, theory is extremely important. And to say otherwise would be like saying you only need three fingers to play guitar. Sure, you'll get by, but given the choice, wouldn't you rather have four?

Furthermore, an understanding of music theory is not only important for understanding your music and instrument, it is also a way of communicating with other musicians. If I said to you, right, let's have a jam in E mixolydian. Would you be able to do it? Or would you just be standing there like a lemon? And how else could I explain this to you? Short of playing each note individually until you remember them.

Back to the original topic, I recommend "Improvisation Made Easier" by Frank Gambale - everything is broken down in detail and applied to the instrument with examples and jam tracks.

Gurj · #15 02-03-2008, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmicDebris

I am with Eggy n' Dee.

There seems to be a few of us here then! Plus after listening to Dee and Ben play, it makes we feel better! I had a few lessons last year and although it helped improve my playing, it didn't help me learn any of the scales and modes. What ever my teacher told me just went over my head