Best guitar work on Hair/Glam Metal Bands

[jim777]

Originally Posted by JESTER700

Ever REALLY listen to YES stuff? You HAVE to be stoned.

I've heard Jon Anderson say he wrote a lot of their 70's lyrics with a joint in his hand. In fact, everyone who saw Dream Theater open for them last year on Jones Beach heard him say it ;-)

[fettouhi]

Originally Posted by JESTER700

So, what's the problem again? Dumb lyrics? All lyrics aimed at teenagers are dumb. 80's cheesy "do me" glam lyrics, overanalytical overintrospective "ponder my navel while on heroin" 90's mumblings, patridiotic country tunes from nowadays. But then, the lyrics on lots of the "serious" stuff was dumb, too. Ever REALLY listen to YES stuff? You HAVE to be stoned. The shrapnel lyrics were generally as banal as Malmsteen's stuff, and that's saying a lot. And the instrumental stuff is worse - indulgent fretboard wheedling for 40 minutes.

Where was I again? But having said all that, I liked a LOT of it! And I still do. Because no matter how dumb that stuff is, it connected with me when I wasn't yet smart enough to know better, and I'm glad it did because I still enjoy it. Just like ludacris does for young people today.

Agreed dude, it is all about the enjoyment .

Regards

André

[jem7vwh]

I think the criticism of 80's lyrics isn't so much that they're dumb, because dumb lyrics are a symptom of every decade, but that they were ridiculously shallow.

Even if you hated grunge (I DID!), you have to admit that it was a bit more honest than glam. No one lived lives like those lyrics suggest, but plenty of people live like Pearl Jam and Soul Asylum's lyrics. Even in this decade, things seem a lot more raw and more back-to-basics.

So if there's a criticism to be made of 80's rock, it is that it was party music with nothing below the surface. Music that only pleases the ears and doesn't penetrate the soul isn't really much more than a practice exercise to me.

[RCB]

Well, I guess its subjective. At the time I was having a lot fo fun, and doing pretty well with the girls, so that music "fitted" the situation much more than Pearl Jam or Nirvana (thank god!).

Anyway, I really dont care about the lyrics, and I can even ignore their content even while Im singing them (thats sound pretty strange I guess...). At least those guys could play and had different playing styles.

BTW, the whole "Sharpnel records" stuff couldnt have happened if it wasnt for the whole heavy metal/glam metal/hair metal thing. This genre helped pushing the boundaries of what guitar playing was. A lot of bands like Winger or Whitesnake in Slip of the tongue had a "double aim strategy", they had the cheesy shallow lyrics, the catchy chorus, etc, etc, but theyu also aimed for the guitar enthusiast. The covers of Guitar World were plagued Issue after issue by Van Halen, Vai, Reb Beach, Kotzen, etc. At the time DVLR hired Vai, then Whitesnake hired Vai, Poison hired Kotzen and then Blues Saraceno, Then DVLR hired Jason Becker, Europe changed from John Norum to Kee Marcello, and Danger Danger hired Andy Timmons for the second record. Every song had to have a guitar solo. Yngwie was also doing glam rock at the time (Eclipse/Fire and Ice).

You may say that it happend across the board in all metal genres because you had Marty Friedman in Megadeth, Alex Skolnick in Testament and Diamond Darrel in Pantera. May be, I dont really care since I heard Cowboys from Hell, Rust in Peace and Practice what you preach at the sime time I llistened to Slip fo the Tongue, Pornographity, Winger, Little aint enough and the likes. I think the guitar thing happened before and more in the hard rock/glam metal scene though.

I mean, IMHO "I would love to" is a glam song without lyrics... and there are many more alikes in the Sharpnel records library.

[JJEMMER777]

Originally Posted by RCB

There is one that I think I should ve included though: Ratt/Ratt&Roll (I know its a compilation, but since the formation remained the same though the albums....)

The guitar riff in "lay it down" and "wanted man" are just SO good (and the solo in wanted man is also nice)

Yeah, I was wondering bout that - Warren Dimartini is da ****

[Algiman]

Skid Row - 18 and Life

Now there's cheesy lyrics!

[RCB]

Originally Posted by jemsite

I don't think it's "underated genre" rather just more musically pointless and easily forgetable.

Hay Glen, another point to defend Glam/Hair Metal.... and I know this is debatable.... but I think that without Hard rock/Glam/Hair Metal we wouldnt care about Ibanez at all.

The brand gained market and release cool models that were mainly used and even created (or designed with participation) of the guitar players in this bands. This is true for the jem series (hence the RG series), the UCGR series (tha account for most of the USA custom production), the RBM series, the PGM series and others.

From the original jems to the FP and the UVMC (all of wich are related to the time when Vai played in Glam Metal bands, before and during the time he was also making PAW), to Warrant playing UCGR, Reb Beach designing the Voyager series, Paul Gilbert in Mr Big with his PGM series, etc, etc, etc. They are all closely related to glam/hair metal, and this guitars are now among the most sought after Ibanez (UVMCs, PMCs, GMCs, certain PGMs, RBM2, UCGR) and for a lot of other desirable models.

[fettouhi]

Originally Posted by RCB

Well, I guess its subjective. At the time I was having a lot fo fun, and doing pretty well with the girls, so that music "fitted" the situation much more than Pearl Jam or Nirvana (thank god!).

Anyway, I really dont care about the lyrics, and I can even ignore their content even while Im singing them (thats sound pretty strange I guess...). At least those guys could play and had different playing styles.

BTW, the whole "Sharpnel records" stuff couldnt have happened if it wasnt for the whole heavy metal/glam metal/hair metal thing. This genre helped pushing the boundaries of what guitar playing was. A lot of bands like Winger or Whitesnake in Slip of the tongue had a "double aim strategy", they had the cheesy shallow lyrics, the catchy chorus, etc, etc, but theyu also aimed for the guitar enthusiast. The covers of Guitar World were plagued Issue after issue by Van Halen, Vai, Reb Beach, Kotzen, etc. At the time DVLR hired Vai, then Whitesnake hired Vai, Poison hired Kotzen and then Blues Saraceno, Then DVLR hired Jason Becker, Europe changed from John Norum to Kee Marcello, and Danger Danger hired Andy Timmons for the second record. Every song had to have a guitar solo. Yngwie was also doing glam rock at the time (Eclipse/Fire and Ice).

You may say that it happend across the board in all metal genres because you had Marty Friedman in Megadeth, Alex Skolnick in Testament and Diamond Darrel in Pantera. May be, I dont really care since I heard Cowboys from Hell, Rust in Peace and Practice what you preach at the sime time I llistened to Slip fo the Tongue, Pornographity, Winger, Little aint enough and the likes. I think the guitar thing happened before and more in the hard rock/glam metal scene though.

I mean, IMHO "I would love to" is a glam song without lyrics... and there are many more alikes in the Sharpnel records library.

There's some really nice stuff in the Shrapnel catalog , Vinnie Moore, Tony Macalpine, Michael Lee Firkins etc.

Regards

André

[jemsite]

I probalby would as those hair model Ibanez axes - then and now - were 100% forgettable. I appreciate the fact that people have interest in the Voyager or a custom graphic Zippered pants RG but I give them no consideration whatsoever ... glen

[Distantshore]

I think the bottom line was just about having fun, so the lyrics really didn't matter. Of course you had producers and managers at the time molding them into a certain image of what sells.(much as today) I have read many interviews today from bands back then who didn't want the spandex, hair and cheesy lyrics...and many times their guitar playing was even reeled in to conformity. Yes, controlled media.
Just how I percieve it anyhow.

[RCB]

Well Glen, but you do care about early jems, UVs and certain PGMs (I presume since you excluded from the guitars you dont care about).

Even though I respect every one tastes, its hard to neglect the influence or impact that the "partnership" between Ibanez and this genre had for the brand.

I know tastes are subjective, but how can you not like the RBM2?!

[jemsite]

FYI - I always felt PGMs were in bad taste & had a negative connotation to the ibanez lineup. Same with RBMs (plus they were ill-timed) YMMV ...glen

[jemaholic]

In retrospect, and compared to the bubble-gum crap or the rap trash on the radio/tv today I would welcome them ALL back! Well, maybe not Twisted Sister, but most of them were great live......what I can remember of the shows anyway. Where's EVH is this list??!!

Originally Posted by jem7vwh

I think that hair/glam metal was 75% terrible.

The vocals were typically lame and shallow.
The drumming and bass were usually very boring.

Really the only thing it had going for it was some good guitar playing. And not every glam band had good guitar playing. For every Vito Bratta, there were 2 CC Devilles though.

Hair bands with solid guitar playing:

White Lion
Winger
Whitesnake
Extreme
Firehouse
Dokken

Terrible guitar playing 80s glam:

Motley Crue
Poison
Warrant
Cinderella
Bulletboys
Great White

I guess new metal's not really any better- but the stuff in the 80's wasn't perfect by a long shot.

[RCB]

I think you forgot DLR and Mr Big in the bands with good guitar playing.

BTW, I never said it was perfect or even close. Just what we all seem to agree about: There was some very interesting guitar playing in some of this bands and most of that music is completely underated by most people as complete garbage. I think that in some aspects its quite better than the most popular music that came afterwards (GRUNGE, NSYNC, RAP, Nu Metal), certainly not the lyrics tough.

The other point i think its important to us particularly is that there probably wouldnt be a jem, UVs, RG, or PMGs, or Voyagers, USA Customs, etc, etc, etc, if it wasnt for that particular genre.

The rhytm section in the first Winger record is not that boring. Its not jazz or prog rock, but for a popular band with a record aimed to the general public, there is some interesting stuff going on (I mean, Rod Morgenstein can really play....). I agree with you though, this was an exception, and the rule is that the drums and bass playing in this genre is boring..... but who cares I play guitar!

[jem7vwh]

Originally Posted by jemaholic

In retrospect, and compared to the bubble-gum crap or the rap trash on the radio/tv today I would welcome them ALL back! Well, maybe not Twisted Sister, but most of them were great live......what I can remember of the shows anyway. Where's EVH is this list??!!

Unfortunately, I have seen most of those bands live, and they blew.

Twisted Sister was terrible. Very loud, but not good.
Quiet riot was terrible. Even louder.
Warrant was ridiculous. I've heard better 8th grade talent shows
Motley Crue was fine, except Vince barely sang
Poison is actually much better live.
Firehouse was amazingly good live.
Great White sucked- all bass and cheesy stage banter
Bulletboys were terrible. Marq Torien can't sing live.
Enuff Z'Nuff sounded like the Beatles through a DS-1
Slaughter was heavier, but not very good live
Dokken was good live. Lynch back in the day and Reb Beach was a monster too.

I didn't really consider Van Halen a glam/hair band. They started in the 70s and except for Dave, none of them did the lipstick and spandex thing. Eddie definately had some hideous pink parachute pants on Live Without a Net, but I don't think it makes them glam.