Question about bootlegs

Jeff · #1 07-29-2004, 10:09 PM

First and foremost, mods, if you feel this is a violation of the rules, feel free to remove this post.

Is bootlegging illegal? As in bringing a tape recorder to a concert or talking to your buddy behind the mixing board to record the show for you? I've seen people selling Dream Theater bootlegs and such out there on the net, and I've wondered if this type of activity is legal? If I were to tape a show and then privately trade it or give it away as a gift, is that still illegal?

I'm not asking for bootlegs or anything like that, I just question the legalities of them :P

GuitarWizard · #2 07-29-2004, 11:40 PM

Hi jeff,

Good question.
I think you are innocently wondering about this issue because of a love for music, and not to start a bootlegging cartell.

Let me give you some friendly advice, so you don't end up with a ex-carnival worker named Vivian for a cell mate, and a can of axle grease as your only friend.

The only time recording a show by a licensed/contracted artist is with written and oral consent of whoever controls the majority of the rights of the artist.

3 examples that will hoefully help:

Example 1) Artist has no rights: This would be like a Clay Aiken. Arista owns all rights to all Clay Aiken performances public and private. If Arista says its ok....Clay has no say. If Clay says its ok....and Arista says no.....its still not ok.

Example 2) Artist and label share all rights 50/50: This would be like in the case of Billy Joel. The name/music/ and performances of William Martin Joel are all licensed 50/50 with Billy Joel and his label Columbia.
Both Columbia records and Billy Joel would have to give concent of recording...... if one or the other backs out.....its illegal.

Example 3) Artist has all controlling rights: This is the best kind for what you are talking about....Black Crowes, Grateful Dead..etc...etc fall in this catagory. This is where the band commands the rights to , at the very least, all of its (their/her/his) public performances.....Bands such as the Black Crowes (now broke up) would even have their concert tickets say "Cameras and recorders ok"......
At a concert like this....everyone would be bringing portable studios to the shows.....
Which that sometimes gets stupid too.

Having a rare performance of your favorite artists can be a very nice thing to have, but its not worth the risk of illegal activities.
In my experience "buddys" at the mixing board usually have big mouths.

And if security gets wind of whats up....they will have no problem removing you from the venue ....... no refunds of course.

Be careful, have fun!
GW

Jeff · #3 07-30-2004, 01:31 AM

Any ideas on the situation with Dream Theater? There are tons of bootlegs of there's out there...I even saw one guy selling them on a website!

Two hands31 · #4 07-30-2004, 01:34 AM

Just because you're not supposed to doesn't mean people won't do it

People bootleg all kinds of concerts and shows. Most people trade them rather than selling them, mainly to keep them among fans who have already and probably will still give out money for the artist's CDs and concerts.

It's the guys with booths that are selling them in large numbers that get in trouble for it.

Petie · #5 07-30-2004, 02:49 AM

There's an interesting grey area because I have many david bowie bootlegs from his recent tour, and in his (off-the-record) words to a fan, he "doesn't give a flying (expletive deleted)" about bootleggers, but the official record company stance is that they are not allowed.

jem7vwh · #6 07-30-2004, 07:59 PM

another notable artist who encourages bootlegging is John Mayer. As long as no profit is made from it, he encourages fans to record and trade concert tapes and cds freely.

Two hands31 · #7 07-30-2004, 08:03 PM

Dave Matthews Band and Jason Mraz are a couple others that encourage bootleg trading (not selling, trading).

matt_cater · #8 07-30-2004, 08:45 PM

"We have always and will always continue to condone allowing people to record our concerts and to freely trade live concerts." - Lars Ulrich, May 2000 Yahoo! chat.

jippy · #9 07-30-2004, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matt_cater

"We have always and will always continue to condone allowing people to record our concerts and to freely trade live concerts." - Lars Ulrich, May 2000 Yahoo! chat.

And what if you obtained your Metallica bootleg from Napster?

Petie · #10 07-30-2004, 11:32 PM

Lars's problem with Napster was related to "I Disappear" from the Mission Impossible soundtrack, not the trading of artist-supported bootlegs.

dex · #11 07-31-2004, 05:40 AM

I've always thought that there is a great overeaction from record companies and artists about bootlegs.
The way I see it, the only people interested in a bootleg (99% of the time anyway) will be dedicated fans that have already bought the complete dicography of the band, gone to shows and are so much into the band/artist that they want to keep hearing new stuff to keep them interested.
If you ask me bands and artist should be encouraging bootleg recordings and swaping because 99% of the people that will be interested and will take advantage of that will be their hardcore fans anyway.

ilia

weserman · #12 07-31-2004, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff

Any ideas on the situation with Dream Theater? There are tons of bootlegs of there's out there...I even saw one guy selling them on a website!

I believe they are quite supportive of bootlegs, at least Mike Portnoy is. He allowed a lot of bit torrent links to boots from the TOT tour on his website (several of which i have

). The only ones that were removed were ones for the concert they filmed for DVD. As far as I am aware, the band is pro bootlegs. You can also pick up some official DT bootlegs, head over to www.mikeportnoy.com i'm sure there is a link somewhere on there.

Artist · #13 07-31-2004, 09:51 AM

I can't remember what it is called, but there is something intended to happen over the next few years whereby you will be able to buy recordings of the concert you were just at, on the door as you leave, or via the web afterwards.
That would be pretty cool, being able to get a decent quality 'bootleg'

jippy · #14 07-31-2004, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Artist

I can't remember what it is called, but there is something intended to happen over the next few years whereby you will be able to buy recordings of the concert you were just at, on the door as you leave, or via the web afterwards.
That would be pretty cool, being able to get a decent quality 'bootleg'

Disclive has already been doing that on a limited basis. This may be what you're referring to. They offered bootlegs for The Doors (w/Ian Astubury frotning), Billy Idol, and most recently, The Pixies. It's a great idea, especially for the fans who enjoy live recordings, to be able to purchase a decent CD quality recording of a show you were at (or just want to get because you like the artist). I'm starting to see a lot more of this (Metallica, Peter Gabriel, and others are starting to offer links to purchase live shows online).