what happened to Darren from ATD? [trying to contact him]

[fettouhi]

Originally Posted by Rich

Ever condsider some of what he had there might have been heavily damaged or destroyed? I'm not saying that''s the reason, or there's an excuse for lack of comunication, but there are plenty of possible reasons for your situation.

Darren was hit pretty bad the last two years with the hurricanes going through Florida.

Regards

André

[Rayzor]

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[Rich]

Any swirl that was uncleared before the storms hit probably doesn't exist now. You're probably a start over from scratch deal.

I'm not going to argue, I'm not making excuses, just saying there are more variables than you are considering.

I've said my peace, I'm done.

[fettouhi]

Originally Posted by Rich

Any swirl that was uncleared before the storms hit probably doesn't exist now. You're probably a start over from scratch deal.

I'm not going to argue, I'm not making excuses, just saying there are more variables than you are considering.

I've said my peace, I'm done.

When the hurricanes hit him in 2004 my first body was only partly clearcoated. He told me at time that all bodies survived the hurricane but the shop was messed up pretty bad.

Regards

André

[Rayzor]

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[Rich]

Partly cleared, is cleared, just needing more coats.

Body survived doesn't mean an unprotected finish survived.

[fettouhi]

Originally Posted by Rich

Partly cleared, is cleared, just needing more coats.

Body survived doesn't mean an unprotected finish survived.

True !

Regards

André

[Rodney James]

Ray, hardly a strait up thing to do by slamming everyone in here as cowards who are not out of control like you.

I see the points made that do not join you in this thread, im sure there is a ton you don't know about in the situation, all we hear is your one side.

Darren has an awesome reputation for many years, obviously something has gone wrong, yet before you run your mouth any further on a public forum, bashing everyone who don't agree with you, perhaps it would be good to get all the facts....Then respond with some respect for others in here.

[Rayzor]

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[sanitarium]

Umm, just read all 5 pages and i'm not sure where to start here. I felt I should reply as I sent my guitar off to be swirled by Herc Fede and it took a year and half to come back in the end. So Rayzor before you started blasting everything I say just remember I went through a similar process of a very long wait, and yes I understand you've been waiting longer and yes I understand it's probably easy enough for me to say as I have mine back.

Herc got ill, and I mean seriously ill, and no body heard from him in ages. We got the odd e-mail every now and again but nothing that hopefull. I took the jerrye approach to the situation. I'd e-mailed Herc alot before I sent my guitar off and I found him to be a very genuine bloke and got on well, so when I heard he was having problems finishing guitar I tryed to be as supportive as possible. This isn't a cowards approach. Where I work I have to deal with a lot of stroppy customers and someone who is an ass hole will always go to the back of the que, no matter how many times they threaten trading standards. Someone who is nice and understanding will get my undivided attension until their problem is resolved.
My point is threating people can have a very negitive effect on the whole situation.
As far as I know everyone has got their guitars back. I think Herc's reputation was shattered but he has started again and is only taking on a few orders at a time so he can finish in managable chunks.
Darren is obviuosly under a lot of stress trying to sort everything out and finish everyones orders. I'm not saying he is justified to keep your guitar that long and with out e-mail contact, but there is a reason behind everything. Someone with his reputation will always have a constant stream of customers so he is unlikely to to shut shop and run off with your guitar and money. I know when Herc was finishing the guitars he wanted them properly finished so when you open the box you get the full wow factor and not just the oh it's half finished guitar.

Okay lets get the shield out ready for rayzors reply.

[jemplayer55]

Hey everybody.... I live in Gulf Breeze Fl., it's just across the bridge from Pensacola, where Darren is supposed to have his shop. I can tell you this.... I have had him make t-shirts for me several years back and never had any problems. Again, that was several years ago.
I will try to see if I can contact him and/or find out what is up!
As far as everyone jumping on his sh_t..... well, I hate to say it but If the guy is not performing, has your money and not contacting his customers, RED FLAGS should go up.
As a business owner/homeowner that was heavily affected by both hurricanes Ivan and Dennis it did make for major problems. But let's face it. That's been two years ago for Ivan and just about a year for Dennis. Any business worth it's "salt" has recovered, had insurance to help with recovery, and if affected, contacted their customers as soon as communications were restored. We also pulled together and helped each other.
OK.... so you say he "lost" everything including guitars & customer information. Well, it's like $9.00 or less a month to host a web site and have an e-mail account. Even if you can't monitor it, getting help from your friends and the business community is always ava. Let's face it.... he could wait for customers to contact him if all client info was lost. And with your (the customers) canceled check, cash receipt, or credit card receipt, he could easily determine who was/was not his customers.
Both the state and the federal government offered assistance to businesses affected by either hurricane. So shy of DEATH there is NO good reason for his customers to be going through this much to either: get their money back, a communication regarding their purchase, or finished product. I read in one post, it took Herc over a year to get someone their guitar body and in another that Herc and Darren "knew" each other. If in fact they do know each other, then in Gods name and simple brotherhood why weren't they helping each other get out of a jamb if there's truly a problem for either one???
Personally, I wouldn't wait a year (or more) for a guitar body.... again that's bad business ethics on the business owners behalf. Businesses don't "grow" by taking on more work than you can handle and not expanding your work force to maintain your deadlines. So you say "they are artists".... true, they could do the swirling. But the prep work and the application of the clear coats and final sanding /buffing could easily be handed off!
You only piss off your customers otherwise and once your reputation is tarnished, I don't care if you're Michael Angelo and are painting the Sistine Chapel. When it comes to peoples hard earned money. Taking it, not performing your service/job, just won't get you much if any more work.
Yeah, ART does take time.... but if you made arrangements up front and time-line has been discussed. Shame on the artist/business owner for not performing.
One other option for those dissatisfied customers is to call the Better Business Bureau of Northwest Florida (850) 429-0002. They may be able to assist you in lodging a formal business complaint. If you feel you have exhausted all avenues and have been "ripped off" then you'd need to contact the Escambia County Sheriff's Office at (850) 436-9630 to file a criminal complaint.
I hope this just about kills this thread.... there is no NEED for everyone to pile on or defend this situation. Defending it is up to the business owner! But look at it this way.... don't perform, and you can see what "word of mouth" can do to a business!

[Rayzor]

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[jemplayer55]

Hey guys one other thing you can do is contact these people and see if he has renewed his business liscense. That would be a good indicator if things have "gone south"!

City Occupational License Department
City Hall, Fourth Floor
Government and Spring Streets
P.O. Box 12910
Pensacola, FL 32521 Phone: 850-436-5693

[dannymills]

Originally Posted by Rayzor

What a way to sum things up - hat off to you bud!!! BIG THANKS FOR YOUR COMMENTS AND CONTACT NUMBERS - Good man!

Amen. I've just read through these last 5 pages and I can't see how anyone can defend Darren against Rayzor or any of the others who have been treated like sh*t by ATD. I mean, I hate to make such an unsophisticated point, but how would YOU all feel if your prize guitar, your JEM7VWH or whatever, had been sent away, or you'd sent a guy $1300 and THREE YEARS down the line you'd heard nothing???? I mean, whatever his problems, they're no excuse for no communictaions or apologies at the very least. If the guy had my guitar but genuine problems getting it back to me, and told me so and apologised, I'd be annoyed but I'd have no problems with him. HOWEVER, to take several expensive guitars and large amounts of cash and effectively disappear is the most disgusting customer service I've ever heard of. I hate to be so evil in my thoughts, but I can't help but feel that if his business goes 'kaput' from this ruining his reputation, it will be somewhat vindicated. And that may sound vindictive and a tad malignant, but there are basic standards that should be upheld within the customer services industry. If you can't adhere to these, you don't belong there.

My two pence (coz I'm British innit).

[andy7jem]

Past good reputation is no excuse for treating people like sh*t.I've lost nothing but feel for the people who have.Sanitarium,of course you can be understanding,you got yours back,and had contact explaining the situation.
And Rodney James,if the guy LET PEOPLE KNOW what the facts are,what is going on,the situation might be different.