Considering switching to racks / midi .

SpikeSocietySucks · #1 05-14-2006, 01:52 PM

Hey up

I'm interested in going into Rack Units and Midi floorboards and such,
And I'm just wondering what options it gives you, how much control over settings you can create, and what the range of it is.

Products I'm interested in are the JMP-1, The behringer V-amp 2, and the Behringer FCB 1010 floorboard.

I'd like to know how these would connect together, how I would go about making a noise from them, and how worth it, it would be to go down that route.

Thanks a bunch in advice,

Spikey!xx

ibanez2005 · #2 05-14-2006, 02:26 PM

The whole midi thing to me seems really dated and alot of hassle, might be wrong though.
What got you interested in midi in the first place?

ned78 · #3 05-14-2006, 02:34 PM

MIDI dated? Right ...

MIDI makes life a lot easier. Pre getting my MIDI setup, it would take 30-40 mins to setup. I'd bring in the 4x12, it's head, then connect it's speaker leads, it's powerlead, then I'd have to run power to the front of the stage, daisy chain that power to my individual pedals, connect all the pedals together, run a cable to the head, run a cable to my guitar. And the downside? Being limited to one amp, having to do a version of riverdance when I wanted to go from one sound to a completely different version.

Now, I've a rack setup. It takes all of 5 mins to setup, no exaggeration. I put my rack ontop of the 4x12, run one cable to the desk, one cable to my MIDI footboard, one cable from the rack to the 4x12, and one power cable into it all.

Advantages? Time saved setting up and pulling down, a myriad of sounds, the ability to go from one sound to a completely different one with just one pedal, and all my gear is safe inside the rack. Plus with my previous setup there were literally dozens of points of failure - any one of the leads, or the pedals could have died, and I'd be unable to gig. The rack has 4 points of failure, so it's more reliable.

And guess what? I'm sure Steve Vai, Joe Satriani et al use racks for just the same reasons.

ned78 · #4 05-14-2006, 02:44 PM

lol, after my pro rack rant, I forgot to answer the OP's questions! I had a Behringer V-Amp Pro last year, and for the money, it's superb. You're going down the right route of using the JMP-1 as a pre-amp, and the V-Amp pro as an effect unit. The V-Amp isn't good enough as a pre-amp on it's own, it takes about half a second to change patches. So bear that in mind when you're changing effects.

Also, the V-Amp Pro's own effects are a little shoddy, take the Wah for example. It's an autowah, you've no control over it. It's not possible to have multiple effects either, you can have certain ones like chorus+delay, but don't expect pitch shifting or anything elaborate.

The FCB-1010 is proven, and reliable. I love it. You should look into the Phantom Power mod for it, it makes setting it up on stage afterwards dead easy.

For the money you're talking about laying out, I'd honestly bypass the JMP-1 and V-Amp Pro. You could have the Pod XT-Pro, or the Boss GT-Pro. I've the Boss, and I'm delighted with it.

ibanez2005 · #5 05-14-2006, 02:47 PM

I aint keen on the digital effects/modellers AT ALL, would tell anyone who plans to use em live to steer well clear, I really tried hard to get mine to sound good live but gave up in the end and went back to stompers.

ned78 · #6 05-14-2006, 02:50 PM

Marty Friedman uses a GT-6!

ibanez2005 · #7 05-14-2006, 02:53 PM

Good luck to him, ive tried most of the ones currently out there and there seem too much emphasis on cramming as many effects in em rather than making the sound quality viable for live/all use(s).

ned78 · #8 05-14-2006, 03:06 PM

Ah hang on a minute, there's a huge different in trying them out, and actually living with them. There are literally pages and pages on bossgtcentral devoted to getting a great tone, because it's difficult to get a great tone. And that's a good thing.

If I was the type of person who tried an amp for 20 mins in a guitar shop and didn't like it, fair enough, but I'm not. I knew the tech specs of the GT-Pro, and what it could do. So I spent a whole weekend locked in to my garage, with my laptop dialling in sounds I could use on stage, and any guitarist who's heard it is stunned. It really does sound like a Mesa on stage, if not better.

You need to invest time in these things, or they gather dust, and people return to the simpler, pedal based setup, and I consider that quitting. I'm sure Roland, Line 6 and the rest don't spend millions engineering these things just so they can be inferior.

Modelling tech is around since the early 90s, and is no longer Vavle Technology's poor relation. Unfortunately, you'll never convert some people. Catholics always believe in God, Children believe in Shrek, and Guitarists believe in the mystical power of the valve. Just because something is hallowed, doesn't mean it's the be all and end all of everything. It's like the vinyl nuts who claim vinyl reproduces sound more faithfully, even though the
needles add noise, and the media is vastly inferior to optical data storage.

Another 20 years and all the myths of valves will be gone.

Go fig ...

Gurj · #9 05-14-2006, 03:13 PM

Give me a tube amp ANY day of the week. Went through my rack stage (triaxis/2:90). Didn't agree with me and went back to my trusty Peavey XXX head.

ned78 · #10 05-14-2006, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gurj

Give me a tube amp ANY day of the week. Went through my rack stage (triaxis/2:90). Didn't agree with me and went back to my trusty Peavey XXX head.

Mind me asking why? The Tri-Axis has tubes, and the Boogie 2:90 has tubes too. Just the sounds?

ibanez2005 · #11 05-14-2006, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gurj

Give me a tube amp ANY day of the week. Went through my rack stage (triaxis/2:90). Didn't agree with me and went back to my trusty Peavey XXX head.

I agree, cant beat em, you get natural sounds without having to sit with a laptop for hours at a time. I'd rather spend the time playing rather than spend ages trying to get a good sound.
Plus i think alot of tone comes out of your hands, not your kit, no matter whether its analog or digital. True Vai and Satch use racks on stage but they play huge arena's and have to drive alot of equipment to fill them.
IMO Vai and Satch have over done it lately, i much prefer their earlier work, alot easier to listen to.

SpikeSocietySucks · #12 05-14-2006, 03:26 PM

I'm interested Becasue at the moment I'm just using a guitar straight into an amp with NO effects shy of reverb becasue I like (And need) the simplicity.

Lately I started getting intererested in pedals and such after playing through a mates set up, but having roadied for his band a number of times I can't stand how long it takes to set up, so what I invisage for me is just chucking a 2x12 in to the mains, Whacking my rack into it, plugging in my guitar and just having the 7 or 8 customised sounds I want waiting for me consistantly on the floor board every time I gig, then being able to go home a bit sooner when the gigs finished.

The delay on the vamp is defo a no go, and as such, I'm interested in the G-Major.

as for the power amp section, I'm interested in a trade of between cheap and good, so I'd love a mesa 20/20 but Shy of living in a dream world I'll probably go for a marshall.

Can anyone put across any postives and negatives, and back up my assumption of it being consistant and simple.

also, any rack suggestions for additional kit would be greatly aprechiated.

Thanks a bunch

Gurj · #13 05-14-2006, 03:27 PM

No reason except that the tone wasn't what I was looking for. Just couldn't give me the high gain tone I get from my Peavey or from a dual rectifier for that matter.
Don't get me wrong, it's an excellent bit of kit, but just not for me.

ibanez2005 · #14 05-14-2006, 03:28 PM

You cant beat a good debate hehehehe.

Gurj · #15 05-14-2006, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpikeSocietySucks

I'm interested Becasue at the moment I'm just using a guitar straight into an amp with NO effects shy of reverb becasue I like (And need) the simplicity.

Lately I started getting intererested in pedals and such after playing through a mates set up, but having roadied for his band a number of times I can't stand how long it takes to set up, so what I invisage for me is just chucking a 2x12 in to the mains, Whacking my rack into it, plugging in my guitar and just having the 7 or 8 customised sounds I want waiting for me consistantly on the floor board every time I gig, then being able to go home a bit sooner when the gigs finished.

The delay on the vamp is defo a no go, and as such, I'm interested in the G-Major.

as for the power amp section, I'm interested in a trade of between cheap and good, so I'd love a mesa 20/20 but Shy of living in a dream world I'll probably go for a marshall.

Can anyone put across any postives and negatives, and back up my assumption of it being consistant and simple.

also, any rack suggestions for additional kit would be greatly aprechiated.

Thanks a bunch

I have a g-major in my set-up. Basically only use it now and again to add a little reverb and delay. I also have a pedal board with a few effects (chorus, Boss DS-1, digital delay, noise suppressor, whammy pedal and a wah). But tbh, I've found myself more and more just using no effects at all.