GSP-2101 and 2120 questions

[jeffrey]

I've been looking at effects units with extensive CC (continous controller) options. Unfortunately, there's only a few with the flexability that I want (at least that i know of, please suggest any I may have missed).

The Digitech 2100 series (rumor has it the 2101 is the best of the bunch, any truth to this?) and the TC Electronic G-Force.

Now, I'm not even going to torture myself with the G-Force unless it's the total bomb, because I really can't afford it right now; well, I can but i can't.

I want to use the effects section of these units only, not the preamp. Both units give you that ability.

I really wish Digitech made a version of that processor with out the d*amn
preamp.

Essentially, I have a Rivera rackmount head (TBR-1SL) that I really like and wish *to use it's preamp section, I just want CC control over all the effects parameters; and the 2100 series and G-Force do that.

Kinda sucks to pay a buncha money for features I'll never use, but to my knowledge, nothing else exists that's even close control wise.

Anyone have any input or insight they can lend?

I'd appreciate any feedback.

Thanks.

[eviltwin]

IIRC Digitech *did* make a non preamp version of the GSP 2101: it's called TSR24. It uses the same S-Disc processor, with the PPC200 you get double the power.

FWIW you could bybass the preamp section of the 2101 or even hook up the preamp section of your amp in the FX loop on the 2101. You'll need to match the levels tho'

I'm not really familiar with the 2112 or 2120 but is seems to me that these units are just slight improvements over the 2101.

The Quad4 is the evolved version of the TSR24.

[jeffrey]

Hey, thanks for the reply.. *

I currently own a Quad 4, it's a wonderful unit..

BUT

It's got little to no CC capability. Hence my dilemma.

I had a few hours this weekend to A-B 2120 and 2101 and I have to say, the 2120 is substantially better then the 2101.

The effects overall were clearer, crisper with a faster reaction from CC inputs (which is the whole reason I want the goofy thing ).

I guess I've sort of answered my own question at this point, has anyone had any problems/experiences with these units?

Thanks.

BTW - there is a way to hook up any of the 2100 series w/ out using the preamp (which is how I'd use it). You just go out of your effects SEND from your amp into the effects RETURN on the loop of the 21xx then out stereo into your poweramp/next rack unit.

I did it this weekend, works like a charm.

[J Todd Beachler]

Jeffrey,

I've never thought of doing it like that before. *I go out of my preamp's effect send and into the FRONT of the 2120. *I then go out of the 2120's outputs and into the preamp's effect returns. *Lastly I connect my preamp's outputs to my power amp.

I'll have to try it your way this evening. *Also, I'm thinking about selling my 2120 with the foot controller if you're interested.

[jay ratkowski]

Any time you use a preamp with your amp head... you will get mixed results. *That is becaue your amp is already using a preamp, and will change the sound put out by the processor. *Some times this is good, some times not. *It also means that if you want to use a different amp, you'll have to adjust the setting on the amp and/or the processor.

I have a Digitech 2101 and a G-Force. *The 2101 sits in my rack and is used for headphone playing now and then... the G-Force is used with my working rig.

As long as you're not looking for distortion and general preamp effects (which it seems you're not) the G-Force is a unit I really praise. *You can find one for around $1200 new if you put reasonable effort into it... which I think is completely worth it.

However, for around $300, the 2101 serves its purpose nicely, I would just avoid getting an actual preamp if I were you.

[jeffrey]

Yeah, my thoughts exactly Jay.

I'm not looking for a preamp at all, just a multi effects unit w/ CC control over all parameters (ie: flange depth, wah, delay feedback etc), anything programmable.

I have a Rivera stereo head that sounds phenomenal (for me at least ); I'm kinda old-school, I think all your gain should come from your amp.

I really just want this for wacky noises and CC control of effects parameters. I'll be using it in conjunction with a TC M-One and a Digitech Quad 4. Those two will generate my real effects and tone, while the 2120 will give me flexibility of doing things over a solid tone instead of having to alter my whole sound to say, play with delay time while I'm doing a solo. Instead I'll have my usually smooth solo sound (long delay, slight reverb, low delay feedback) and be able to make all kinds of racket having it come out clean in the primary delay.

I hope all that ****
I just typed made sense. Hehe.

In a nutsh*ll
, I won't be using the preamp section of any unit I get. My Rivera has 3 gain stages, which is really too much as it is.

I just want CC control over all parameters independent of my main processors. There's surprisingly few units that provide total CC control. To my knowledge the 2100 series, G-Force and Roland GP-100 (which is discontinued).

I really do like the G-Force, but for what I want and never using the preamp, I think it's overkill for me; although I am a big fan of TC.

Thanks for your input guys.

[jay ratkowski]

Small note(yet important): *The G-Force is NOT a preamp.

[eviltwin]

Jay, is the G-Force a lot better than the 2120, FX-wise?

btw doesn't a 2120 come with two processors standard, on the 2101 this is optional. That does affect sound quality, especially when using CC or when switching programs mid-song.

Lastly Midi Preamps get a lot of bad rep, I don't really see why a rackmounted tube preamp (midi or not) should sound very differently from the tube preamp in a 'real' amp. The two main differences are probably that 'real' amps have tube tone circuitry and that the input is straight into a tube. Once you start using Wah or Whammy, etc. before the amp input or use active EQ, these differences vanish.

I haven't used the preamp section of my JCM900 in years, I prefer the flexibility of the 2101. The tube poweramp colors the sound to such an extend that the sound doesn't feel too sterile or 'digital'. [whatever that may be]

[quickdraw]

All depends on what version of the 2101... there were a few different configs , with even a few more software rev's. *If you get one of the 2101 Limited Editions it comes with the upgrade installed (the additional S-disc and memory), Then there was a later version again which also had the dual S-discs and the "Artist Upgrade". *I also use mine as noted earlier (into the effects return to eliminate the pre-amp) while using the unit in my home studio... very effective and true Stereo to boot in this Config. *For being an older unit I think this is one awesome piece of gear, especially considering how cheap you can find them for nowadays!

[jay ratkowski]

I think the G-Force has higher quality effects than the 2101. *The only place the 2101 has the G-Force beat (IMHO) is with distortion... but the 2101 has that wretched digital distortion... so you lose either way if you ask me.

I think the G-Force is a lot quieter... that is a big deal, seeing as how my old house has NO grouned outlets (fire hazard!!). *The flanger seems a lot more "real" and the delay seems much better as well. *Those are the two most noticable differences to me. *The delay on the 2101 just seems kinda cheap... like it's a lower-quality stomp box.

G-Force doesn't seem as digital... with the 2101, to my ears... it's digital city. *I don't like digital too much. *

[jeffrey]

I do like the G-Force, but for me, it's just not worth the money. List on the d*amn
thing is $1799, you can get one for about $1200 or so if you try or buy one for about $800 offa ****, but for the money... I just don't feel it's worth it.

I have other TC gear that I really enjoy, but they are way out in left field for that kind of money for what it offers.

The 2120 sounds substantially better then 2101 imo. I spent about 3-4 hours this weekend with both units and over all the 2120 sounds better. The effects are much less sterile and cleaner, the CC control is fantastic and very fast.

This won't be my primary unit anyway, I have a TC Electronics M-One and a Digitech Quad 4 for that. This is for well.. noise for the most part, and to let any sounds I make process cleanly through my other units.

I just picked up a 2120 off of **** for $400 that's in perfect condition. I just can't see paying more then doublt that for a G-Force, but I also haven't had 3 hours to play with one (only about 1.5 hours).

For what I want it for, noise, CC control, effects independant of my primary unit, the 2120 is perfect. Cheap on ****, even reasonable new (699).