Marshalls suck with gain!

[RSVampire]

I tried the TSL100 watt and whenever I muted a string.....that string would sound almost clean....it wouldn't chug.....or even do anything.....but open chords sounded pretty nice.....wish it had a TON of gain....like a modified JMC800 or 900. But the sound wasn't there for a Marshall. Any comments on this?

[diek]

This is my opinion. All marshalls lack in gain and warmth. Everytime I play through any marshall I feel like my teeth are crooked, I say "bloody" too much, and then I proceed to play bad british rock I like the 4x12 cabinets, but when it comes the the electronics (heads, amps, and combos), they all sound like they were designed for the treble rebels from the 80's. Got beef?....

[Chris Johnson]

C'mon, suck or blow - make up your mind! Yeah, ever since the Mesa Rectifier line came out Marshalls have been exposed as the raspy beasts that they truly are. I think the key to getting the Marshalls to sound good(and they CAN sound pretty good!) is to open them up and let the power tubes sweat a little. Also, it has become standard practice among people playing heavier music to hit the front end of their Marshalls with a distortion device like a DS-1. Remember, when old Jim Marshall was first laying down designs for his amps, the Fender Bassman circuit was the model his rigs were closest to in terms of circuit design, and we all know how well Fenders chug.

[strat110]

Chris has got it in one.

Marshall although they claim to be high gain are nowehere near the Mesa/Boogie or 5150 areas of brutality. *Marshall's are more about power tube tone than preamp and as such need to be cranked to the max [which means a Powerbreak or THD Hotplate for those of us not slaying Madison Square Gardens!].

A Marshall will have more clarity than the 5150 and Boogie and also a slightly faster response time to picking. *Also a Marshall requires a good set of EL-34's not the lame stock ones.

A Marshall is a useful tool if used properly.

Andy

[wilch]

I agree totally with strat110.

But I don't agree with the "marshall's lack gain and warmth" statement.

I know that my DSL100w head screams at 6 gain and 5 volume. But yeah, at any less than 4 on the volume takes away tone. And at 3 you start to go deaf.

I can get the DSL to chug just like the guitar's on Metallica's Master Of Puppets with the use of an EQ, and compressor, and no Distortion pedal in the line.

Believe me, I was never a fan of Marshall's. And I do think that a Mesa Tri-axis kicks the crap out of any marshall, and POD's get a tighter metal sound. But as strat110 said, "a marshall is a useful tool if used properly".

[jeff l]

110,
* * * Whachootalkinbout?! My JCM 900 came with a nice set of Svetlana EL-34's. *I think that some people who love the Rectifier are into scooped metal tones....I've way outgrown that sound.

* * * * * * * You really should'nt say an amp sucks until you've spent a proper amount of time tweaking it. I have the SL-X model which can go (with my modified RG-570 w/ DiMarzios and the tone pot removed) from chimey clean (only with the tone mod on the git) to AC/DC style Plexi crunch to fat, singing lead tones (with my SD-1 engaged for a slight boost).

* * * * * * * * * * * * If that's not enough then I can always dial in metal tone with my trusty GE-7 with sucked mids and a bass boost in the effects loop. *I guess what I'm saying is that my Marshall provides a nice canvass and with a little help from a pedal here or there it can be a very versatile amp. It also gets some kick-a$$ classic and hard rock sounds with just the guitar, chord and amp.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *I had a 5150 head and I sold it after a few years....it was just too da^^n buzzy. My Marshall is a much better, smoother and more versatile amp than the Peavy. Granted, a Peavy is not a Mesa but I know the tones that you're talking about.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * One last thing, nothing in the world sounds like a cranked Marshall. There are heavier, more distorted and *louder amps to be had but they just don't have 'the sound' that I love. *

* * * * * * * * * *

[ripl3y]

Well said jeff, I'm with you all the way.

I've never experienced any lack of gain or tone and I've used 900's through to my current TSL602 it's all down to how you carress those dials and with all the people (stars included) who use them Marshall must be doing something right.

Personally I find mesa's a little restrictive and all too "samey", lacking in range I suppose.
I don't wanna' sound like Metallica or anyone else, I wanna' sound like ME and at the moment Marshall still let me do that.
(my 0.2p

Steve

[strat110]

Jeff L

then you are very lucky, the crazy thing with the SL-X's is that Marshall make them with 6L6's for us in the UK - Oi Marshall NO EL34 EL34 EL34...that is the Marshall sound...grr that makes me so mad.

I did have a SL-X [with 6L6's] btw!!

[jeff l]

Strat,
* * * * Yeah man, that's what I heard. Marshall put 5881's in the UK models of the SL-X and the USA ones got both EL-34's and 5881's. *I've seen both of them over here in the U.S. *Wierd stuff..... * * *

[rgr]

A 5881 is a military designation for a 6L6, so they are basically the same tube, the new 5881s are a little more musical than most of the new 6L6s, Svetlanas excluded. * The good news is that any competent tech can do a minor mod to a 6L6 or 5881 equipped Marshall to make it EL34 compatible. *I talked to Marshall about this because 6L6s and 5881s draw less current that EL34s so I was concerned that they might have skimped on the power transformer but the guy there assured me that they were the same transformers. *The main reason they switched is because for a period of time in the late 80s, early 90s there was a problem getting a good supply of decent sounding EL34s, Svetlana has now remedied that so "real" Marshalls exist once again. *
Roger

[strat110]

Probably the best endorsement for the SL-X heads is that Scott Gorham [Thin Lizzy] uses them for his Marshall tones on the latest Lizzy tour.

[Side Slide]

Quote: from rsvampire on 12:50 am on Dec. 18, 2000
I tried the TSL100 watt and whenever I muted a string.....that string would sound almost clean....it wouldn't chug.....or even do anything.....but open chords sounded pretty nice.....wish it had a TON of gain....like a modified JMC800 or 900. But the sound wasn't there for a Marshall. Any comments on this?

My quote from today is " *MARSHALL SUCKS *"

I got rid of my marshall amp and am very happy with my HUGHES & KETNER stack

Tip of the day *never buy a marshall amp with mosfets
unless you want to see your repairdude every week

[Gabe Nickelson]

Marshall suck for what YOU want them for. *They don't suck in general... except in the 60's when they'd catch fire due to the insulation in wiring.

My tone I get from my JCM800 is great. *However, I rarely just plug into a Marshall. *I'll never get the sound I want. *I run through a preamp and simply use the Marshall as a power amp. *I prefer older Marshalls, especially the JCM800's. *However, I like the Legacy much better and if I could do it all over again I'd buy a full Legacy stack with 2 heads. *You just can't beat the price-for-tone quality of a Legacy.

My Marshall 4x12 1960 30W Stereo switchable cabs are to die for.

Gabe

[Josh Blagg]

You guys answered the question correctly.

Marshall amps = POWER TUBE SATURATION.

If I could not have power tube saturation, I would not play guitar. *If you were playing a 100 watt Marshall, then I doubt you had it turned up all the way. *The amp on 5 is worthless compared to what it sounds like on 9 or 10, for any Marshall.

High gain preamp distortion does nothing for me really. *It's the fat, warm power tube saturation that makes great tone and singing sustain.

[Screamin]

1982 JCM800 100watt w/GrooveTubes.
The best amp I've ever owned. Goes from crystal clear to the best, purest natural gain you could want. If I need anything else I just hit the effects.
Those Triple Rectum-Fryers are cool, but too much gain for what I need, it would be wasted power.

Don't knock de Marshalls, mon......they're not for everybody....but they don't suck.

Screamin'




(Edited by Screamin at 12:27 am on June 20, 2001)