power/pre amps

[SkaKid0991]

I'm sort of confused about how power and pre amps work.

I'm on the market for a new amp (because my solid state marshall is on the verge of death). I was looking into combos, for portability, and then running it into 2x12 or 4x12 when I need more power.

What would happen if you ran your guitar straight into a preamp and a power amp, or just a power amp? I think I've seen this on top of a cabinet, but it might have just been a weird head.

Would this work? Or do you need a head or a combo in there, too?
Sorry I'm so clueless...

[The Madness Here]

simply put (in reality its a tad more complicated) the pre-amp creates the 'character' of the sound while the power amp makes it loud.

so if you wanted to use a rackmount amp and another amp, then you'd want to run a pre-amp into the combo.

[SkaKid0991]

Ok. Well, what if you didn't want another amp? Could you run like
Guitar -> Preamp -> Power Amp -> Cabinet?

[The Madness Here]

that's entirely possible. And precisely why you can buy seperate pre and power sections.

You can use a digital modelling pre-amp like a pod, and then another power amp, like say a mesa boogie 2:90.

typically one uses rackmountable tube pre amps and power amps as well as effects like

guitar > Mesa Boogie Tri-Axis > TC electronics G-Force > Mashall EL34 50/50 power amp > cabinet. However, if you're going to go the route of tube pre and power amps, it gets quite pricey. If you plan on starting out on a rack set up and you're on a budget, then you may want to use the power amp from an existing amp (like your marshall) and use a digital pre like the behringer v-amp or the pod.

with a fully rackmount amp you have other things to worry about, like midi control, power conditioning and many other things.

[SkaKid0991]

Alright, thanks. It sounds a lot more complicated (and expensive) than I had previously thought, so I think I'll just go the way of a combo and a cabinet or something. Thanks again.

[The Madness Here]

many people on these boards actually use this method for amplification, they're also probably much better equipped to help you out, and probably make it seem a little less scary.

[SkaKid0991]

Yeah. I'm not so much worried about the fact that it's confusing, because I actually like playing with this stuff and learning about it. I don't know why but I was actually thinking this would be cheaper than buying something like a Mesa Rectifier Combo and a 2x12 cab. I now realize I was sadly mistaken

[tobe]

Hi man,

it depends on what kind of gear you look at. You can pick up say an old ADA MP-1 and a peavy power for pretty cheap, and get an inexpensive rack..for probably under 600 US. However, you are right in thinking it would be cheaper to get a 2x12 and a head, that might be of better quality. You can get, for example a mesa recto 2x12 head for like 350 on an auction site, plus shipping, and I have seen used Single rects go on the same site for 600-700...These of course just being examples based off your post. If you want un complicated..go with a head and a cabinet...racks have tons of options, and sometimes tons of headaches...however once you got it all sorted out it can make setting up and tearing down a breeze. Combo amps can be really cheap, like a Crate, or really expensive...I looked at a Bogner 2x12 combo that was 2,600.00. I personally do not like running a pre amp into another amp...Its kinda like running to pre amps in series into a power amp..its causes a lot of noise, and IMO results in some tones that are not always the pleasant...but differn't strokes for differn't folkes...Good luck in your search, Tobe

[bpd111]

Well, there are many options that would be cheaper than a rectifier combo and a 2x12, especially if you go second hand.

Let's talk about some basics first. Your dying Marshall combo is a combination of a pre-(before)amp (distortion/clean channels, EQ, etc.), power (the actual) amp and speakers.

The rack option simply separates the three. All this does is give you more options in the sound you're looking to put together. Is it easier to transport? I guess it could be, but I don't think portability is the reason to go with a rack set-up.

Basic rack set-up: Guitar >> Preamp >> Power Amp >> Speaker Cabinet.

Instead of a combo where you have a guitar, amp, and maybe some effects to transport, you've got the guitar, rack (they get pretty big) and a speaker cab.

You could buy a combo, like the Recitifier, that has a outlet for a extension cab for when you want more output.

Hope this clarifies some things.

[SkaKid0991]

Thanks everyone. I think I will go with a combo and a cab (for when I want more power). I like the idea of having more portability.

Tobe, where have you seen a 2x12 recto for 600-700? I assume your talking USD.
I've only seen second hand 1x12 recto combos for 1000.

[Ferrous Lepidoptera]

Originally Posted by tobe

I personally do not like running a pre amp into another amp...Its kinda like running to pre amps in series into a power amp..its causes a lot of noise, and IMO results in some tones that are not always the pleasant...but differn't strokes for differn't folkes...

Just to be clear, many amps have an insert that allows bypassing the built-in preamp, so you aren't really putting two preamps in series. (It wasn't clear whether you were aware of that or not, from what you wrote.)

[dangomles]

Nice you have posted this thread, because i had the exact same doubts...
So, if i understand correctly, i can run my guitar like this: Guitar > Boss MT-2 > Line 6 Pod XT Live > (VHT) Valvulator Rackmount preamp (Which i dont have...YET!!!) > and through a Power amp (Which do you recommend?) > and finally, a Cabinet...
No combo, no head, right?

[The Madness Here]

yes, but with both the pod AND the vht, you won't need the metal zone.

In fact, Id say that you don't even need both the pod AND the vht. If you like the sound of the vht, then Id say get a dedicated effects processor and ditch the pod since the pod is, itself, a pre-amp. Or, if you prefer the sound of the pod over the vht, you certainly don't need the vht.

[dangomles]

I actually use the pod as a "pedal board" just for effects, but i think my sound definitely lacks of balls, and i think the vht will do the job...In fact, in the future i would like to get rid of the pod and but some single effects

[dangomles]

buy* some single effects