Recording cranked amps at comfortable levels

[guitarob]

I'm considering getting one of these for recording at home:

http://www.axetrak.com/

It's an isolation cabinet for recording cranked amps without disturbing the peace.

My question is how well do these isolation cabinets (and others like Randall and Demeter) work in reducing the overall volume, while also providing the sweet sounds of a truly cranked amp? Is the sound level that can be heard outside of these boxes really diminshed?

Looks like the best of both worlds - recording amps cranked to their sweet spot and low volumes without getting divorced.

[JESTER700]

It doesn't say what the isolation is in dB anywhere on the page that I could see. They probably use an inefficient speaker so that they start several dB lower (than a more efficient one would be).

I would definitely try to hear one with your rig before buying, or make sure it's refundable. This will not sound like a "normal" cabinet, since the mic is inside a fairly small sealed cab which is likely sealed on both sides of the driver. That's an atypical configuration. Plus, they don't say much about the mic.

It may still be better than a Power Brake rig or modeler in your opinion; I'm just saying it isn't exactly a 4x12" sealed or 2x12" open cab.

[jemaholic]

Just my 2 cents:

I finally learned some years ago that you get much better sounds (and nuances) from low-volume amps every day of the week. I have achieved very pro-sounding recordings from my Marshall practice amp while testing the room for my Marshall 3/4 stack.( 1960B + 1936 2-12")

Plus I doubt your mics will perform well getting yelled at 100+ dB from a cranked big amp.
Jimmy Page always used a little Fender 1-12" tube amp to record with.

Check it out- you may be pleasantly suprised.

[Jamie]

Get a Hot Plate attenuator. Best of both worlds.

[frankfalbo]

The cranked amp phenomenon is really the sum of three parts. First is the tubes blasting. That can be achieved with attenuators or lower wattage tube amps. Then there's the speaker breaking up. That can be achieved with a 1x12 instead of a 4x12, or perhaps there's no real acceptable way to replicate that without actually doing it. Third is the mic itself (usually of sm57 ilk) crapping out (oops, I mean "overdriving") because it can't take the air pressure at close range.

Like jemaholic, I too could live without those last two stages. They are really starting to become "old school" you know, classic rock tones that when you go back and listen to them, really aren't that great. I mean, sure they are great because of the vibe they captured and the feel etc. But they are not quality sounds. They also many times invoked a fourth stage which was tape saturation. With a quality tube rig and a large diaphragm condenser mixed with an old technology close mic, I get much better sounds at livable volumes. And you could still build your own isolation cabinet. It wouldn't have to boast such high db reductions if you weren't pushing the speaker that hard. But then you lose any room ambiance (maybe you don't want any). I would consider trying a mastering program like T-Racks, and use their tape saturation simulator, and mess with hitting the compressor or the multiband limiter real hard. You might find it gives you just what you're looking for in a guitar tone once you lay a good clear track. And you can always undo it, or blend it with the original track (try a 75% opposing pan) for a huge multitracked sound that doesn't wake the neighbors.

As for "does the cabinet work?" I'm sure it's pretty good. You can't stop low freqs totally without lead or concrete, though. So don't expect it to be whisper quiet. My big beef with them is what I mentioned before. You crank the speaker but you lose the room sound. Plus I feel (and I could be wrong) that without the free air movement you choke off the speaker reaction. Another reason to just record a cleaner track and spend the money on a tube compressor you can saturate, or some good software.

[kent]

Another option would be the Palmer speaker simulator stuff. I have a PGA 05 and I actually prefer the tone of it to most of the micing results I've gotten. It is not a plug and play device and it took a few calls to some friends I have in real recording studios to get the thing tweaked but now it is an indispensible part of my live and studio rig.

[Jai]

Interesting...I've been thinking of building something like this to record with at home. What I was most curious about was how well sound was blocked out. Does it really make it that much quieter? What about if I just built an iso box for my 2x12 combo? Would that still get quiet results outside of the box? If anybody has any experience with these, let us know. Thanks!

[guitarob]

I e-mailed them asking about the sound leakage and their reply was:

"In terms of sound leaking from the box, I would say it is the volume of soft whisper. This device was created out of necessity for that very purpose. It really is a quiet device. "

I'm going to order one of these next week. I'll let you know how it turns out.

[Jai]

Originally Posted by guitarob

I e-mailed them asking about the sound leakage and their reply was:

"In terms of sound leaking from the box, I would say it is the volume of soft whisper. This device was created out of necessity for that very purpose. It really is a quiet device. "

I'm going to order one of these next week. I'll let you know how it turns out.

Sounds awesome, can't wait to hear your report on the product!

[guitarob]

Jai, I just put my order in today. I should receive the unit in a week or so.

I spoke with the owner/inventor Jeff Harris and he was kind enough to answer all my questions. He was very helpful.

He mentioned that the Axetrak will be formally introduced at NAMM this winter. He also mentioned that the unit will have a built in heat sink. This is because a lot of users have been really cranking their amps into it, and it needed something to dissipate the heat - like a hotplate.

I can't wait to try it out with my new Legacy!

Stay tuned...

[machinediva]

but check also this site:
http://www.amptone.com
I found it very helpful and every topic you discussed is treated with some depth...

[guitarob]

Well I finally received my Axetrak. I paid $359 total for it. I've had it for a few days now and I have to say that I am quite happy with it. Still need to tweak with my amp settings to get the best sound.

Physically the Axetrak is quite small. It is about the size of a small cooler and only ways about 16lbs. It is covered in a charcoal gray carpet material and the overall build seems very solid. There's a handle on top of it so you can move it very easily. I've got mine tucked under my workdesk. On the front is a 1/4" speaker input, an XLR out, and a red LED that lights up when a signal is fed to it. Also, there is a fuse holder. The speaker is fuse protected. You're instructed to start with your volume low, and slowly increase the volume until the LED starts to glow brightly. If you drive it too hard, you pop the fuse. Not knowing its limitations, I managed to do this my first time playing into it. Fortunately, a spare fuse is included. I'd still have a few spares anyway.

Inside, there is a 6" Eminence speaker and a permanently mounted dynamic cardoid type microphone, similar to the SM57. You cannot move or adjust the mike. No big deal in my view.

So, I connected the speaker out (8 ohms) from my new Carvin Legacy combo to the Axetrak, and connected the XLR out into my mixer for recording.

Those of you familiar with the Legacy will know how loud it is when the volume is set to anything above 1. I had the volume set to 6 on my Legacy at the 100 watt setting and although I wouldn't say that the Axetrak is exactly "whisper quiet", it is very manageable and definitely suitable for bedroom levels or late night jamming. Put the Axetrak in a closet or wrap a blanket around it and then you get "whisper quiet". You can easily hold a conversation at normal speaking levels with the Axetrak at this volume setting. All my gear is in a spare bedroom on the 2nd floor of our house and my wife who was downstairs a floor below didn't even know I was playing. (mission accomplished on the noise level ) My dog even stayed with me (and no, my dog is not deaf!)

There is a deep plug on the Axetrak that can be removed for extra bass. However, with the plug removed, the volume level out of the Axetrak is significantly louder, but still within tolerable bedroom levels.

As far as sound quality, I really like how it sounds with the deep plug removed. The sound is very huge. Lots of good crunch. Almost like a 4X12 cab, but not with the face-ripping volume.

I haven't used it in a live situation yet, but I imagine it would work very well.

The manual says that it was designed for overdriven distorted tones. However, the cleans and bluesy semi-cleans sound very good as well. I played my EMG 85 and 81-equipped RG570 and a stock single-coiled Fender American Strat through it and the Axetrak sounded very good with both guitars, both clean and distorted.

I'm still tweaking my amp eq settings to get the best recorded tone. But so far, I am very happy with this unit. I'll post some samples hopefully this weekend.

For the money, if you want that sweet spot saturation from your tube amp and don't want to lose your hearing (or your spouse) I definitely recommend trying this little box.

[Distantshore]

Wow I'm sure my neighbors would love this ( I live in an apartment complex) Thanks so much for the info, can't wait to hear some samples.

[Jai]

Yeah thanks for the review, I'm still thinking about what I should do for my 2x12 combo, as far as recording it while being respectful to others that can hear it.

[guitarob]

Here's a generic 80's style demo I recorded with my Carvin Legacy combo and my new Axetrak isolation speaker.

Settings on the Legacy were:
Vol = 5
Drive = 8
Bass = 7.5
Mid = 7.5
High = 6
Presence = 6
100W setting with stock tubes.

Guitar used was Ibanez RG570 with EMG85 in the bridge. This is a straight-up recording - no post eq or effects added.

I used Cakewalk Homestudio 2004XL for recording and the drums are from Drumkit from H*ll.

I was able to record this very quietly with the Axetrak. I just monitored the sound thru my studio monitors at a comfortably low level. The volume on the Legacy was at 5 and no complaints from my wife who was 2 rooms away.

Any comments welcome. Thanks for listening.

http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Me..._000021094.mp3