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Patrick SIMS (custom shop in TN, USA) experiences

122K views 596 replies 130 participants last post by  bluedot 
#1 ·
hi there, i`m jens from germany and i just wanna tell you my story with patrick sims. Sorry, for opening another SCS therad, but this guy has ripped me off. i have seen, that the big SCS thread was closed and i can´t read x sites of post, to find out, why the thread is closed and why he is no longer vendor for the JEMsite.

there is a second cause, to open this thread. this is the third time (it´s my own fault) that i was ripped of by an american luthier. the first time was, that thy guys from LEGACY ONE ripped me off. i have lost 300USD, than chris woods, he still hasn´t payed my refund (i´m waiting now more than a year) and now, patrick sims.

because of the bad experineces with these other guys i look for someone with a good reputation, to built me swirled sevenstring body. here on the jemssite, a lot of user told, that patrick is a good and smart guy and he really did great work.

i wrote a mail to him, we cleared everything and so i orderd this RG shaped, 7string body with a blue/black/white/purple swirl, with black picasso grafix. this was in november. he wrote, that he will finish the work at the end of dezember. i heard nothing from him, till i wrote a mail in the middle of january, asking him, whats up? he immediatelly wrote back, that he has difficults with the clearcoat, but he will finish the work in the upcoming two weeks. this was the last mail i became. i wrote him countless mails through his page, trought the jemsite and through maypace....but nothing. i have no chance (its the same **** as with legacy one)....

has anybody made similar experineces with patrick?

has anybody a advice, what to do?

thanx guys!
 
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#308 ·
Man I feel bad when i hear musicians out of money and the lenght of time to get if anything back, bodies, necks hardware etc. 2 years is way too much time to get a guitar part done.
For those who have their monies taken by this Patrick Sims? If you can prove it? Then you need to contact the Attorney General of Tennesse. Half the time, if they see alot of customers with complaints they step in. Also contact the BETTER BUSINESS BUREAU. The business men that care about their companies want a "good" standing with the BBB. Many people use the BBB to find the standing of a particular company/business before they do business with that particular company.
 
#312 ·
I'm glad you're happy with the guitar but the design is nothing unique and as far as craftsmanship goes, Patrick's early guitars with made with Ibanez RG necks that had the headstock grafted to get that shape. I received this information straight from Patrick himself. That doesn't make the neck bad in anyway. He just didn't make it.
 
#313 ·
Chris Woods actually built the first few SCS guitars using Ibanez necks. I know Patrick is cutting most of his own stuff now, but I think Chris is still helping him out.

Not that there is anything wrong with that as Patrick is making a go at his own line of guitars, and is doing what he must to get off the ground.

Chris Woods and Patrick both can do great work when they set their mind to it. It is the time management and customer service that seems to be the downfall.
 
#314 ·
Chris Woods actually built the first few SCS guitars using Ibanez necks. I know Patrick is cutting most of his own stuff now, but I think Chris is still helping him out.

Not that there is anything wrong with that as Patrick is making a go at his own line of guitars, and is doing what he must to get off the ground.

Chris Woods and Patrick both can do great work when they set their mind to it. It is the time management and customer service that seems to be the downfall.
They should consider merging businesses and hiring someone to handle financials. Perhaps 2 negatives can become a positive then. They're both in Tennessee, right?
 
#318 ·
Ah, I thought Woods was in TN. for some reason. Well, still, one must wonder why people will still give them money with such horrid track records. If I've learned anything since I began using the 'net, it's do your FRICKIN' research...especially before you send someone a lot of cash. :)
 
#319 ·
I do know now about doing the research part. At that time, I didnt think that these guys had such awful track records. As for me? i really needed that 24fret skolnick body replicated to a "T". I was thinking Sims was a reputable business. Going by Sims web page I could tell he makes decent bodies. But there is no reason to lie to your customers and "blow" them off.

I dont know maybe it just me... But if i was a guitar builder/CNC user, and there were Forums, Threads posted that my business sucked in customer service? I would do some cleaning of my awful business practices to keep new business coming in. its "101" in Business. also in the same class they teach ya "something better always comes along" Gabriel CUSTOM Guitars? has a nice ring to it. our motto... "DO you live in a HEAVY METAL UNIVERSE?""""
 
#320 ·
I dont know maybe it just me... But if i was a guitar builder/CNC user, and there were Forums, Threads posted that my business sucked in customer service? I would do some cleaning of my awful business practices to keep new business coming in. its "101" in Business. also in the same class they teach ya "something better always comes along" Gabriel CUSTOM Guitars? has a nice ring to it. our motto... "DO you live in a HEAVY METAL UNIVERSE?""""
See, the thing is though with the advent of the Internet, Patrick doesn't have to rely on just local customers to keep him in business nor does he just have to rely on word-of-mouth or marketing expenses. If one just visits his website all they see are the shiny finishes which are very enticing. He also throws his own line of B.S. in too ("My finishes are like glass and they're better than anyone elses"). Most folks don't have experience with other painters (I was one of them) and don't realize that while his finishes are high quality, there are plenty of other painters out there who's work is just as good.

The way I see, Patrick figures he can afford to piss off a few customers because of his aggressive self-promotion. The more customers he gets in total, the less those few customers matter percentage wise. In other words he deals in volume.

To be blunt, Patrick takes care of more customers than he pisses off but that's no excuse to treating any customer poorly.

The best thing any of us can do is not support him directly or indirectly. Don't do business with him and tell every guitar player you know to do the same. Just point anyone you know to that Sims Warning site and they'll get the picture.
 
#326 · (Edited)
The whole scenario is unfortunate. About a week before I got my ICJ100WZ, I shipped an IC300 to Sims to have custom painted. Needless to say, the project is way overdue and Sims is not forthcoming on a completion date. I put a timer on it, and with the 8-10wk turnaround originally quoted is now 219 days overdue. Aug 13, 09. Still has my money, still has my guitar.

I've taken to pointing people to "that site" that is posted as a warning, but I've learned my lesson. Next time, do more research. I'm attempting to warn as many of my guitar playing friends as possible.

I'm glad that it was a relatively inexpensive lesson.

Edit: Has anyone sent messages to the guitar manufacturers he lists on his page and asking why they're using his shop - which is known for notoriously poor customer service? I can't imagine that a smaller guitar manufacturer would want their name linked to a business that does not communicate well with it's customers.
Edit #2: If you choose to do so, I'd send e-mails to Dean and Gibson/Kramer. I've already been in contact with earlier vendors.
 
#327 ·
Yeah, we all know about him. Please, fellow Jemsiters, never use anyone who demands all money up front. For my next project, I'm using Rodney Reams from LiquidFX Airbrushing, who comes highly recommended from Nate Perle. He asks 20% up front which is an agreeable percentage in my mind. Plus, I've seen great examples of his work on his site.
 
#330 ·
We're at 2 years plus for my RG560 neck...Got the body a few months ago. Patrick was supposed to refinish the headstock to match, as well as supply me with some touch-up paint for another guitar (yeah, that was $10 pre-paid as well).

I tried emailing again last week. It was read, but not responded to.

Cheers,
Butch
 
#331 ·
Responding to Patrick's post (as LGM) in the recently closed LGM thread. It belongs here anyway, since it shows more of Sims's attitude toward his customers.

You guessed wrong. Your not having a hold up b/c of Alan waiting on a body from me, b/c Alan does not have any bodies on order with me at the moment. Last shipment I sent him was over 2 months ago & that was for 6 bodies & that was everything he had placed an order for.
Wrong. I placed my order with Alan April 10th. He was expecting a shipment from you "within a week." I'm not guessing here. He told me that he was going to start on my swirl as soon as he received the shipment from you. Which was late.

You can say what you like about me & the work I do, but theirs a reason why Alan chose to stop using Jaden for his bodies & start buying all of his bodies from me for his swirls. Not only that, but he actually pays more to buy them from me & have them shipped to the UK from the US.....
I have nothing to say about the work you do. I've never seen it. I've seen pictures on your website that I liked. I even went so far as to offer you my business, which I wouldn't have done based on the posts here. In fact, the only reason I even considered using you for custom work was because I trust Alan, and he uses your bodies.

As far as attacking other suppliers goes, that's pretty lame. There may be a good reason Alan switched to using you. I'm not really interested in the behind the scenes of what goes on between two aftermarket suppliers. What I am interested in, is how you treat your potential and paying customers. It seems you FAIL at understanding that WE are your best advertisement, and coming on Jemsite and blasting at your customers and your competition only serves to remind us to take our money elsewhere.
 
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