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flu shots...for or against?

3K views 33 replies 15 participants last post by  axemanrio 
#1 ·
i'm personally against them. i have not had one in YEARS and i'm fine (physically anyway.) sure i get sick, but it's not too often and i throw it off fast. anyone getting a flu shot will get sick as well, since they can't possibly cover the hundreds or thousands of different strains out there. correct me if i'm wrong, but the flu shot is a very small sample of the flu virus. small enough for your body to fight it off, and therefore preventing you from getting that flu again. there were some cases where people got sick from getting vaccinated.

this came up since my wife asked if i wanted to have my 16 month old son vaccinated. if it can help his immune system, to start him out well, then fine. If it's just shots to get shots, well, i am not sure i want that. is it necessary? he has been sick a few times in the last 16 months but i'm wondering if these are needed to form the "building blocks" of his immune system.

Steve
 
#2 ·
I think everyone should get them. It's called herd immunity - if 70% of the population is vaccinated (for example) then the rest are protected by association - the virus can't spread as easily. People that say "I haven't gotten a flu shot and I didn't get sick" are reaping the benefits of all the people that DID get the shot. As for your son - I'd do it - you don't want young kids or the elderly getting the flu - it can get pretty serious.

Edit: And to point out the obvious - getting a cold and the flu are two entirely different things - you'd know it if you actually got the flu
 
#3 ·
Best thing to do for a kids immune system is to let them get ill. But, for those with other medical conditions or compromised immune systems a flu shot makes sense, even though, as you mention, it will only be against one particular strain each time.

Not quite the same thing, but kids growing up in a completely sterile environment have all sorts of problems once they get into the real world and get exposed to things their immune systems have never met before. People forget we are animals, designed to live in mud!
 
#4 ·
getting vaccinated certainly wouldn't hurt, unless of course you are being exposed to the new H1N1 vaccine that they are beginning to administer. But even that vaccine isn't potent enough to lead to serious side effects, and least at this stage in development.

The flu spreads like wildfire in schools, it would be wise to vaccinate the kids.
 
#7 ·
i haven't read any posts except for the first one.

Before I continue I want to ask. How many of the persons here are actual Physicians? Who is a position to seriously have any criteria on this concerns? There are historical medical reasons why flu shots exist nowadays. Before you commit any stupidity please consult with a certified physician that you know is a good one.

Thank You.
 
#8 ·
LOL Jim.

Pediatrician would be a better sounding board than online forum since they should know your child's health better than any other health care professional. They also know what other vaccines are administered and the timeline.

I must say i'm fascinated by the immunization gestapo who get all angry when someone refuses a shot. I mean since they are vaccinated they are "protected" so then STFU :) ....glen

PS - some states require flu shots for school barring religious or other exemption.
 
#11 ·
LOL Jim.

I must say i'm fascinated by the immunization gestapo who get all angry when someone refuses a shot. I mean since they are vaccinated they are "protected" so then STFU :) ....glen

PS - some states require flu shots for school barring religious or other exemption.
There are people who are allergic to components of the vaccine, or are unable to take it for health reasons. The only way they are protected is if enough of the rest of population is vaccinated, so the virus doesn't spread. If the vaccine is FREE - I don't see why you wouldn't want to get one. I'm not worried about myself - but I'd feel bad if I transmitted the flu to someone who couldn't handle it . . .
 
#12 ·
how are they free? LOL.

allergic... pharma conglomerates say they're totally safe AND effective. hmmm ;)

the virus (and many new strains for which the immunization has no effect on) will live & circulate & mutate with or without vaccines... make no mistake about that.

it's sorta disingenuous to spin getting a flu shot as protecting every other person alive... glen
 
#13 ·
how are they free? LOL.

allergic... pharma conglomerates say they're totally safe AND effective. hmmm ;)

the virus (and many new strains for which the immunization has no effect on) will live & circulate & mutate with or without vaccines... make no mistake about that.

it's sorta disingenuous to spin getting a flu shot as protecting every other person alive... glen
Look - there are only a few types of influenza circulating at any given time - they make the vaccines by trying to predict which surface antigens the viruses will be expressing the next season, based on analyses of circulating viruses the previous year. The influenza doesn't mutate like you're thinking it does - there are a finite number of surface antigens that can be expressed. Often, they guess wrong, and the strain that spreads one year is one they haven't included in the vaccine.

Here in Canada - the flu shot is free, so there's no reason not to get it.

And protecting every other person alive? No. But if enough people are vaccinated, the virus won't be transmitted as readily - thereby increasing the effectiveness of the vaccine considerably - and protecting many of the people that haven't been vaccinated. When people are getting vaccinated the goal is not to vaccinate EVERYONE - it's impossible - but if enough are, you effectively eliminate the pathogen. Have you been vaccinated against polio? I doubt it.
 
#15 ·
I agree with that Rotti. I haven't taken the shots since I was a kid and don't plan to. I know people who get the shot religiously every year and get more sick more often then me. I ride public transportation everyday and very rarely get sick. Yes I have had the flu and know what the nasty symptoms are. I throw it off in a few days max. But this question was in regards to the little kids.

As far as our pediatrician, she gave us the option and wanted to know what we thought. I will be speaking with her. I was simply wondering not about the pros and cons, but simply, for those of you with kids, what did you do. My main question for the pediatrician will be, does it aid in the building blocks or building the immune system for babies / toddlers.
 
#17 ·
I work in a lot of Dr. offices and I notice that they are bombarded with letters from the various gov't bodies informing them about vaccines, along with lots of misinformation. Or at least playing down the negatives and exagerating the benefits.
Now a good Dr. would do some research and come to thier own conclusion but how many of them just pass along the bias info they recieve from Gov't agencies and Drug manufactureres? (the people makeing a proffit from this)
I have spoken to Dr's and nurses about vaccines and some of them are just plain wrong. Of course there are some great very informed Doctors too. hopefully you have one of those.
 
#19 ·
Rotti malpractice plays a large factor here (especially in the USA). It's sad how in many ways health care has devolved into this in the USA.

If a primary care physician goes against the AMA's recommended care & "reasonable & customable care" (which is fed from government agencies with big pharma controlling) they open themselves for litigation and worse. Cover your ass is the #1 thing in big medicine. Multiply that times 10 with kids. In short the safe answer is follow the guidelines i posted above otherwise the dr/clinic/hospital heightens their exposure to scumbag lawyers looking to take advantage of a broken system looking to prove willfully negligent care & possibly loss of license to practice medicine.

this also is a factor with parents. add in a divorce scenario where one spouse will argue "neglect" due to the other parent missing a flu shot.

you deviate from the norm you become a target.

This thread alone imho shows a jury of peers is readily available that will side with medicine 6 days a week and twice on sunday.

Now, talk to the pediatrician off the record after a few beers vs in their office and on some issues you'll hear what seems like night & day discussion... glen
 
#20 ·
I'm all for it. I had a pig flu shot which combined seasonal flu with it due to me having to work in a vaccine factory. Now i'm no stick in the mud but if you work in the moblie service industry as i do coming into contact with hundreds of people every week. I A: don't want down time due to some pratt in an office who thinks they are fit to come into work with it causing me loss of earnings and B: Don't want an out break on multiple sites i've vistited causing people to be ill and loss of revenue to these company's and staff. To think you don't need it it a little self centred when you work with large volumes of people!
 
#21 · (Edited)
Glen brings up excellent points and is correct, unfortunately. Unfortunately, because that is how this "system" works. I can add to the corruption by adding in something a little off the flu shot thing. My father-in-law passed away a couple years ago due to CJD, or...mad cow disease. it was brutal. he went from perfectly fine to completely deteriorated / vegetable state, within 3 weeks, lasting only a month. that's how it works. the 3rd hospital confirmed what the problem was after brain biopsy. the head neurosurgeon spoke to me off the record that "this never happened...and that's the way the government likes it." i asked about the dozen cases a year in the US, since i had been doing research. the surgeon said TRY HUNDREDS minimum. he wasn't too comfortable telling me what he already did so i let it go. one thing the government does, as you know, is feed animals to animals. most of the animals used as food are diseased. for pennies, the government can oversee having feed for the animals instead of resorting to the other...but they won't. the surgeon said it would literally maybe raise the price of ground beef by 3 or 4 cents, passing the cost on to us...but they won't do it. i guess PENNIES add up and lives aren't worth it. Of course they don't want anyone to know the real numbers...panic would be a problem for the beef industry. so, my father-in-law, a forgotten stat...in their books.

back to the flu.... i will get with the pediatrician. just curious if you guys took your little ones or not.
 
#25 ·
I don't know why they put mercury in there either. When my daughter was born they wanted to give her a vaccine against Hep B. I think it was B. All newborns get this shot at birth. The hospital makes you sign a waver so that got me thinking and I did a little research. Turns out that vaccine had mercury in it (I think the flu shot does too), some people think the vaccine is related to autism and other issues. I decided that she didn't need that vaccine at birth and she got it later when she was a little older. At that point they had a Thermasol (mercury) free version. The hospital did try to pressure us into giving her this vaccine at birth which makes no sense to me.
I spoke to a doctor about it once and he told me that there is more mercury in a bottle of baby food than in the vaccine. I don't know if thats true or not. Sounded like BS to me. But maybe we are talking about such minute amounts that is not an issue. I don't know.
 
#28 ·
I've been in the health care field for a long time and Ive heard both sides of the Thimerosal / Mercury debate. It's makeup in most vaccines is actually 0.005% and it's used as a preservative/ anti-biological measure. It's to kill the virus that is used as part of the vaccination. In all seriousness, they claim you can't get the flu from the flu shot, however, every time I've gotten the shot, I contract what it was to protect against. :\
In any case, things like autism occur in such a small fraction of the population to begin with and then vaccination related occurrences are even fewer in numbers. Statistically speaking, it isn't likely your lil ones will be affected. That said, I haven't taken my kids for any flu shots. They have had their normal MMA, Rubella, etc. Flu, my kids get over it faster than I do. My oldest has an amazing immune system. He and I had the same flu bug last year I had it for a week, he was better in 2 days. H1N1... BRING IT ON !
 
#29 ·
thanks bamm. not sure yet what to do. there are notices up all over the city for flu shots and we just got an email at work for the flu shots...$15 only. i thought about it only because of my son...i can get it to help keep it from him...but, i haven't had one in YEARS. who knows. thanks for the great info.
 
#32 ·
Ugh, might be regretting my stance soon... I think 2 or 3 co-workers who sit near me have had it and at least one co-worker's child. I'm certain those jerks will pass it on to me.

In the meantime, Wisconsin continues to be a hotbed for H1N1, I don't get why. Lots more schools have closed down.
 
#33 ·
Ugh, might be regretting my stance soon... I think 2 or 3 co-workers who sit near me have had it and at least one co-worker's child. I'm certain those jerks will pass it on to me.

In the meantime, Wisconsin continues to be a hotbed for H1N1, I don't get why. Lots more schools have closed down.
Don't worry about it. You get the flu, you get better, done. The vaccine probably would not prevent the flu and who knows if it's safe.
 
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