2010 Jem7V-WH identification - Page 2 - Jemsite
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post #16 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-17-2021, 07:57 AM
 
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Re: 2010 Jem7V-WH identification

Well, Im gonna be the nay sayer and say "nay".

Ill start with probably the most "alarming" thing, but it could just be the angle + lighting obfuscating it.... but... where are the scallops on the 21-24??? lol that alone is enough... but Ill get REAL nit picky here ->

1) The back of the headstock pic -> that stamp is wrong. The ink is way too dark; black almost. Real stamps are more gray in color. Also, the stamp "thickness" is much higher than a real one. Now bear with me ... but the walnut "stripes" are also too thick. Subtle, but definitely thicker than they are supposed to be. Tuners are legit though.
2) using the photo you posted in the other thread, that body is absolutely fake.
3) The dimarzios are 100% fake
4) the screws for adjusting the pickups are bigger than they are supposed to be
5) that fretboard doesnt look anything like the rosewood used on the models of that time. Its ridiculously uniform in color, and lacks porosity incumbent with indian rosewood.
6) the routing around the bridge is wrong, and the pickguard is also wrong

Heres what it looks like to me -> That neck looks DAMN similar to a "premium". Probably REALLY easy to copy and counterfeit at that point. Combined with the fact that quite a bit of that is most certainly fake without a doubt, it stands to reason that the neck would also be counterfeit.


The case? Thats real
Attached Images
File Type: png differences2.png (1.43 MB, 18 views)
File Type: png differences1.png (2.03 MB, 15 views)
File Type: png differences3.png (2.03 MB, 13 views)
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post #17 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-17-2021, 08:22 AM
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
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Re: 2010 Jem7V-WH identification

Quote:
Originally Posted by bob493 View Post
Well, Im gonna be the nay sayer and say "nay".

Ill start with probably the most "alarming" thing, but it could just be the angle + lighting obfuscating it.... but... where are the scallops on the 21-24??? lol that alone is enough... but Ill get REAL nit picky here ->

1) The back of the headstock pic -> that stamp is wrong. The ink is way too dark; black almost. Real stamps are more gray in color. Also, the stamp "thickness" is much higher than a real one. Now bear with me ... but the walnut "stripes" are also too thick. Subtle, but definitely thicker than they are supposed to be. Tuners are legit though.
2) using the photo you posted in the other thread, that body is absolutely fake.
3) The dimarzios are 100% fake
4) the screws for adjusting the pickups are bigger than they are supposed to be
5) that fretboard doesnt look anything like the rosewood used on the models of that time. Its ridiculously uniform in color, and lacks porosity incumbent with indian rosewood.
6) the routing around the bridge is wrong, and the pickguard is also wrong

Heres what it looks like to me -> That neck looks DAMN similar to a "premium". Probably REALLY easy to copy and counterfeit at that point. Combined with the fact that quite a bit of that is most certainly fake without a doubt, it stands to reason that the neck would also be counterfeit.


The case? Thats real
If you look here you will see the scallops: https://www.jemsite.com/forums/f15/ngd-woot-166931.html
Why do you think the DiMarzios are fake? They look bang on the same as mine on my 05 7VWH. And your comments about the rosewood are impossible to back up from a single image from one angle. Some of my rosewood fretboards look super uniform - it's an organic material, not all pieces look the same. The way the shadows fall in that image makes it impossible to see the rosewood pores. Of course the stamp will be looking darker when the light is coming from behind the headstock and the backside is shaded which also will give it a thicker appearance in a picture like this (same for the walnut stripes). I can't say whether the body routing is off or not, but the pickguard may very well be after market, who knows. The pickup height adjustment screws look the same as mine as well.

The most telling thing of all is for one to produce a fake of this quality, you'd be sending your margins out the window - you're making profit from fakes by cutting costs selling them below retail of the original instrument.

Last edited by joabim; 02-17-2021 at 08:29 AM.
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post #18 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-17-2021, 09:33 AM
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
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Re: 2010 Jem7V-WH identification

Quote:
Originally Posted by joabim View Post
If you look here you will see the scallops: https://www.jemsite.com/forums/f15/ngd-woot-166931.html
Why do you think the DiMarzios are fake? They look bang on the same as mine on my 05 7VWH. And your comments about the rosewood are impossible to back up from a single image from one angle. Some of my rosewood fretboards look super uniform - it's an organic material, not all pieces look the same. The way the shadows fall in that image makes it impossible to see the rosewood pores. Of course the stamp will be looking darker when the light is coming from behind the headstock and the backside is shaded which also will give it a thicker appearance in a picture like this (same for the walnut stripes). I can't say whether the body routing is off or not, but the pickguard may very well be after market, who knows. The pickup height adjustment screws look the same as mine as well.

The most telling thing of all is for one to produce a fake of this quality, you'd be sending your margins out the window - you're making profit from fakes by cutting costs selling them below retail of the original instrument.
edit: I stated before hand, that the scallops could just be a lighting/angle thing.

1) For starters, jems of that time period no longer had stamped dimarzios.... Second, the pole pieces are wrong; the plating is just ... not right. They sure look similar, but they arent right.
2) Theres several images of the guitar, thats not rosewood mate.
3) and sorry, but no, the stamp "looking darker" has nothing to do with it being WAY thicker. Also, the neck stripes are just way too thick. I showed two examples right next to it. You can *clearly* see what Im talking about.
4) The body routing is off... like what are you trying to defend here? Thats not even alder...
5) the screws are NOT right, the plating is wrong, and they are different sizes.
6)... why would the pickguard be aftermarket ??

Im not sure what "quality" youre seeing here. CNC machining takes care of the lions share of the "it looks right" part. I just checked on a chinese site that has counterfeits, you cant tell by the inlays anymore. The body is very very obviously fake by the routing alone. Theres no legitimate jem7vwh that would EVER leave the factory with routing like that. On top of the fact that its NOT ALDER. The pickguard is very very very obviously not right, the pickups are stamped, despite them not being stamped from this era of production; as well as them having horrendous plating.


And, frankly, Im not really "guessing" here.

Do me a favor, tell me which one of these looks "real" to you, which one has "quality"? I deleted the VERY easily fixable obvious problem from them.
Attached Images
File Type: png necks.png (357.8 KB, 18 views)
File Type: png stamps.png (264.7 KB, 14 views)

Last edited by bob493; 02-17-2021 at 09:50 AM.
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post #19 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-17-2021, 11:42 AM
 
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Re: 2010 Jem7V-WH identification

Quote:
Originally Posted by bob493 View Post
edit: I stated before hand, that the scallops could just be a lighting/angle thing.

1) For starters, jems of that time period no longer had stamped dimarzios.... Second, the pole pieces are wrong; the plating is just ... not right. They sure look similar, but they arent right.
2) Theres several images of the guitar, thats not rosewood mate.
3) and sorry, but no, the stamp "looking darker" has nothing to do with it being WAY thicker. Also, the neck stripes are just way too thick. I showed two examples right next to it. You can *clearly* see what Im talking about.
4) The body routing is off... like what are you trying to defend here? Thats not even alder...
5) the screws are NOT right, the plating is wrong, and they are different sizes.
6)... why would the pickguard be aftermarket ??

Im not sure what "quality" youre seeing here. CNC machining takes care of the lions share of the "it looks right" part. I just checked on a chinese site that has counterfeits, you cant tell by the inlays anymore. The body is very very obviously fake by the routing alone. Theres no legitimate jem7vwh that would EVER leave the factory with routing like that. On top of the fact that its NOT ALDER. The pickguard is very very very obviously not right, the pickups are stamped, despite them not being stamped from this era of production; as well as them having horrendous plating.


And, frankly, Im not really "guessing" here.

Do me a favor, tell me which one of these looks "real" to you, which one has "quality"? I deleted the VERY easily fixable obvious problem from them.
1. Ah would you look at that, a 2012 7vwh with the dimarzio stamps: https://reverb.com/item/365782-ibanez-jem7v-2012-white
I assume that is fake too? And you're saying the plating is "wrong" - dude, it's impossible to differentiate between shades of gold (which is inherently yellow) when you have no idea what kind of white balance the camera was using for that shot. You can't just go "i dunno bro, it looks off or something".
2. And you're going on and on about "that's not rosewood mate" - you've literally posted comparison pics with an allegedly legit 7vwh showing rosewood of equal uniformity, porosity and darkness no?
3. Alright, I do agree I perceive them as thicker too, but looking at various jem samples I can't say it's not within reason. Maybe I need your laser vision to see these things you feel are so obvious.
4. Also, the alder comparison (https://www.jemsite.com/forums/attac...5&d=1613571921), what are you trying to show? That one is darker than the other? The grain looks the same man. The exposed alder on my 7vwh is darker than your comparison pic too, should I be worried? No, I'm not defending the body routing - I'm just saying I can't tell whether it's unreasonably bad or not.
5. See 1.
6. Yeah the pickguard - you brought it up as having the wrong curvature leading up to the trem. I'm just saying it's possible it's aftermarket. See, you're still complaining about the pickguard - I just tried to come with an explanation.

I don't know, I'm sure you could tell me. For all I care, both could be genuine and you've just decided that one of them is fake because of some higher power
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post #20 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-19-2021, 03:19 AM
 
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Location: Michigan USA
Posts: 109
Re: 2010 Jem7V-WH identification

Quote:
Originally Posted by joabim View Post
1. Ah would you look at that, a 2012 7vwh with the dimarzio stamps: https://reverb.com/item/365782-ibanez-jem7v-2012-white
I assume that is fake too? And you're saying the plating is "wrong" - dude, it's impossible to differentiate between shades of gold (which is inherently yellow) when you have no idea what kind of white balance the camera was using for that shot. You can't just go "i dunno bro, it looks off or something".
2. And you're going on and on about "that's not rosewood mate" - you've literally posted comparison pics with an allegedly legit 7vwh showing rosewood of equal uniformity, porosity and darkness no?
3. Alright, I do agree I perceive them as thicker too, but looking at various jem samples I can't say it's not within reason. Maybe I need your laser vision to see these things you feel are so obvious.
4. Also, the alder comparison (https://www.jemsite.com/forums/attac...5&d=1613571921), what are you trying to show? That one is darker than the other? The grain looks the same man. The exposed alder on my 7vwh is darker than your comparison pic too, should I be worried? No, I'm not defending the body routing - I'm just saying I can't tell whether it's unreasonably bad or not.
5. See 1.
6. Yeah the pickguard - you brought it up as having the wrong curvature leading up to the trem. I'm just saying it's possible it's aftermarket. See, you're still complaining about the pickguard - I just tried to come with an explanation.

I don't know, I'm sure you could tell me. For all I care, both could be genuine and you've just decided that one of them is fake because of some higher power
Cool dude, thanks for your input.
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post #21 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-19-2021, 03:54 AM
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Re: 2010 Jem7V-WH identification

One of the most valid points was those rounded corners of the guard which on an Edge model would have a much smaller diameter round, and if you have a real vwh and you're repainting why would you have a crappy aftermarket pickguard.

And he did show me some Chinese shop that can cut pretty convincing bodies, just like there are several custom builders in the US. The difference is the still crap hardware on the Chinese, but swap that out and you're left with questions.
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