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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-20-2010, 06:55 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Glasgow
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Jem Help

I am looking for some help with my Ibanez Jem 7VWH. I am having a sort of "oscillation" problem which is extremely noticeable the higher I fret. It becomes noticeable as I pass the 12th fret and the oscillations become quicker the closer I get to the body.

I have never had such a problem with any of my guitars ever before and haven't got a clue on how to fix this issue.

It sounds almost like I have a delay effect on when playing the notes, most notably on the G string. It is there to hear on clean and distorted channel but is more evident on the distorted channel.

Because of this problem I can not play a long straight note higher than the 12th fret without hearing a sort of tremelo effect going on.

If anyone has any advice or know-how on this I would be grateful of your knowledge.

Thanks in advance.
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-20-2010, 08:25 PM
 
Join Date: May 2008
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Red face Re: Jem Help

Hi, the sound you hear is the effect of flutter. You see, tremolo systems like the Edge Pro balance on knife edges, and the design makes tuning stability great when doing trem work such as divebombing and pullups, but then there is little contact between the bridge and the guitar body itself.

The strings and the springs on the back are in a sort of balance with each other. Push on the bar and you shift the balance in favor of the strings, pull on it and you shift it in favor of the springs. The springs at the back are usually "bouncy", so if you hit the strings with enough force, you will cause the springs to "bounce" a little, and combined with the very tiny contact between the bridge and the body, your tremolo and consequently the strings will sympathetically vibrate along with the spring bounce.

It's among the consequences of owning a knife edge-equipped tremolo system, although you could reduce the effect to a certain degree by using something like cotton to stuff the spring cavity with. Hope this helps.
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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-20-2010, 08:31 PM Thread Starter
 
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Location: Glasgow
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Re: Jem Help

Would tighter springs solve this problem any? It really is annoying, I have watched countless videos online of other people and their Jem's and their Jem's all seem to work flawless without this noise.. mines is so noticeable it's really off putting.
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-20-2010, 08:42 PM
 
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Wink Re: Jem Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by satchgear View Post
Would tighter springs solve this problem any? It really is annoying, I have watched countless videos online of other people and their Jem's and their Jem's all seem to work flawless without this noise.. mines is so noticeable it's really off putting.
Unfortunately, it usually makes it even more "bouncy". It's fairly easy to simply stuff the spring cavity with some foam or cotton. Put some foam or cotton under the springs and see if it goes away, if not, just stuff in some more. Just be careful not to stuff too much underneath that the springs start pushing upward.

One upside of having the flutter effect, though, is that it can allow you to do radical trem effects just by flicking the arm. You'll get a sort of gargling sound, Vai uses this a lot
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-20-2010, 09:17 PM
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Re: Jem Help

I won't say that what was cited above is wrong but
I have never owned a guitar without a tremolo in 31 yrs of playing
right now I have a lo pro that's over 20 yrs old, a pretty new graphtec and a brand new ZR
and I have never experienced what you are dealing with
I'd have that trem checked out.
or at least pull it completely apart and reinstall it with proper lube
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-20-2010, 09:41 PM
 
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Re: Jem Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by theapprentice View Post
Unfortunately, it usually makes it even more "bouncy". It's fairly easy to simply stuff the spring cavity with some foam or cotton. Put some foam or cotton under the springs and see if it goes away, if not, just stuff in some more. Just be careful not to stuff too much underneath that the springs start pushing upward.

One upside of having the flutter effect, though, is that it can allow you to do radical trem effects just by flicking the arm. You'll get a sort of gargling sound, Vai uses this a lot
This is actually a very accurate response in my opinion. Alot can depend on the springs in your guitar. On my swirl Jem that I put together, I used a floyd rose intead of a Ibanez bridge. I can get a wonderous array of flutter manipulations by using certain techniques. I love the flutter technique and use it alot for accentuating notes at times. I've always felt that it is a very common attribute to floyd rose type bridges.

My old RG7620 would do it but not as well as my Jem 7DBK. My Jem 7DBK was about my like my current swirl jem. I think it just depends on the bridge and springs. I've got a new JS20S(with the Edge III) and it's tough to get it to do a flutter and if it does it's a very quick flutter.

My old Jem and my Swirl would do a flutter for as long as the amount of pressure you used. If you just bounce or tap on them, it would flutter slightly. Or if you use one of Vai's techniques of snapping the bar back violently, you'll get a long flutter.

Trick is to push back and then let it snap back on it's own volition. Makes a wonderful flutter.

I wouldn't worry about bridge flutter unless it really annoys you, then you can just reinforce the bridge(basically keep it from moving a whole lot). But then what's the point if you're going to have a Lo Pro or Edge or Floyd Rose, you want that sucker to move as much as possible with the least amount of effort.
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-20-2010, 10:12 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Glasgow
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Re: Jem Help

I have tried the cotton under springs trick that was mentioned before and it never done nothing for me. I think maybe my problem is deeper than just bridge flutter.

I am going to take it to a luthier first thing tomorrow morning. I feel there may be an underlying problem with the bridge.

Thanks to everyone who responded.
satchgear is offline  
post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-20-2010, 10:36 PM
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
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Re: Jem Help

Two things to try.

Tighten your Trem Arm, when mine is loose i sometimes get that effect.

Also change strings, sometimes its due to a string that is just completely shot.
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 07:49 AM
 
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Re: Jem Help

Also check your pickup height. If a pickup is too high it has too strong a pull on the strings for them to vibrate normally which results in an abnormal sound.
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 08:10 AM
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
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Re: Jem Help

Mine actually did what you're describing when I first got it as well. I'm pretty sure I even posted a thread here about it. I took it back where I got it, I took it to the best tech in town, and no one could identify the source.

It went away on its own.

I would spend a few days divebombing the hell out of the trem while you play. I think it'll wear those springs some and solve your problem.
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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 09:27 AM
 
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Re: Jem Help

Check your intonation. ...And please don't use the 12th fret harmonic vs 12th fret note. Use open string vs fretted note.
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