Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!! - Jemsite
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post #1 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 07:56 AM Thread Starter
 
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Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!





Is this a stock truss or did someone replace it? Apparently, the guy who owns this guitar can't adjust it because he has no clearance to fit a wrench. Rich, would appreciate your input on this one.

Jimmy
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post #2 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 08:01 AM
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

It's either moved to the back of the channel or it's just always been there. The easy fix is to take the nut off and Dremmel a rout to fit the truss wrench. You can clamp the neck into backbow and use a shim to push it to the front of the channel if there's enough room behind it when you do.
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post #3 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 11:35 AM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

looks like someone has already been trying to dremel a channel. Are those scratches all under the TRC? It also looks like some type of glue/epoxy was used on the nut/rod, possibly a previous attempt at a fix?

Either way, if that nut IS glued in place you'll need to customize a nut wrench to fit it. You'll need to cut off (dremel) part of the wrench socket, making it look like a crows foot wrench, to get on the nut.
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post #4 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 11:42 AM
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

If you clamp the neck into backbow the wrench will go on. It will also tap on with a hammer
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post #5 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 11:49 AM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

The pic looks like there MIGHT be epoxy above the nut. If there is, it won't get clearance even in back-bow. need better pics to know for sure though. I would certainly try putting it in back-bow first to see what happens. I would hope it works, but I wouldn't expect it to.
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post #6 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 12:08 PM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

What type of wrench are you using? A regular mechanics box wrench won't work. Just though I'd ask cause that looks normal to me.
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post #7 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 12:13 PM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by musikron View Post
What type of wrench are you using? A regular mechanics box wrench won't work. Just though I'd ask cause that looks normal to me.
the nut is too close to the bottom of the channel......there's no clearance to use a standard nut wrench.
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post #8 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 12:50 PM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

Apparently Jimmy decided to post my question from a different forum here.

Anyhow, I made some measurements. The space between the nut and the bottom of the channel is 0.04" (1.1 mm) and the thickness of my box wrench is 0.05" (1.27 mm). I plan to grind down the box wrench by ~a quarter of a millimeter (0.25 mm) and try that.

To get a crowfoot wrench (or an ignition wrench) in I'd have to widen the route or grind the wrench walls. 1/4 of a mm grinding of the box wrench seems easiest.

To answer some other questions, there doesn't appear to be any glue or epoxy on the threads or nut itself, so I am hopeful that it is adjustable.

The purpose of adjusting is so I can level and crown the frets.
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post #9 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 12:53 PM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

I'm responsible for all dremel marks, but I chickened out after realizing it'd be quick difficult to clear the channel under the nut with the nut on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RGTFanatic View Post
looks like someone has already been trying to dremel a channel. Are those scratches all under the TRC? It also looks like some type of glue/epoxy was used on the nut/rod, possibly a previous attempt at a fix?
I am hesitant to rout the pocket any deeper than it already is as the W-1 necks are quite thin. I've already sanded back my dremel marks. I literally only have a 1/4 of a mm to go, but why not just modify my $5 too instead of a neck that sells for $150?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich View Post
It's either moved to the back of the channel or it's just always been there. The easy fix is to take the nut off and Dremmel a rout to fit the truss wrench. You can clamp the neck into backbow and use a shim to push it to the front of the channel if there's enough room behind it when you do.
There is already some back bow, and I am hesitant to clamp it into back bow without first trying the simpler solution of grinding a wrench.



Quote:
Originally Posted by RGTFanatic View Post
The pic looks like there MIGHT be epoxy above the nut. If there is, it won't get clearance even in back-bow. need better pics to know for sure though. I would certainly try putting it in back-bow first to see what happens. I would hope it works, but I wouldn't expect it to.
PS what picture do you need?

Last edited by winaki; 12-22-2011 at 01:05 PM.
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post #10 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 01:06 PM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

Here are some additional pictures:


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post #11 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 01:43 PM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

A box wrench won't do it. Do you have something similar to this?
http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Tools/Wr..._Wrenches.html

I believe a Taylor truss rod wrench will also fit. I have never had to route away wood to remove a truss rod nut before, and I don't think you need to here. Even if it is a little tight on that end, the right tool will be able to slip in there and lift the rod up slightly allowing you to remove the nut safely.

If you don't have a wrench like that you could hit the local guitar store and use theirs, though you should find one for each of your guitars.

Really you are making this problem harder than it is, take a deep breath, relax, and find that wrench. After you get the nut off its easy to clean up in there and get things fitted right, but don't make things worse on yourself by routing out the channel.
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post #12 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 01:57 PM
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

Yup, I would have assumed you were using the correct Ibanez 7mm TRW.

But, I have had around 10 Ibanez over the years that you could not get a correct wrench on without either force, or routing the channel deeper. There are plenty out there.
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post #13 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 01:58 PM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

I mistakenly call the pocket truss wrenches that you link to box wrenches.

The wrench that I have came with my prestige. It is 7mm with a wall thickness of 0.05" (1.27mm). The space between the nut and the wood is 0.04" as already stated.

I've also tried a 7mm nut driver, which has thicker walls. A taylor truss rod wrench will probably not fit, but I am just guessing that taylor has imperial instead of metric dimensions.

I am not for routing wood, I am for grinding my "box wrench" or a harbor freight nut driver.

So in summary, no tool (that I have found) has a thin enough wall to fit. I am not freaking out on this. Taking my time and going slow, like I do with all repairs....

Quote:
Originally Posted by musikron View Post
A box wrench won't do it. Do you have something similar to this?
http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Tools/Wr..._Wrenches.html

I believe a Taylor truss rod wrench will also fit. I have never had to route away wood to remove a truss rod nut before, and I don't think you need to here. Even if it is a little tight on that end, the right tool will be able to slip in there and lift the rod up slightly allowing you to remove the nut safely.

If you don't have a wrench like that you could hit the local guitar store and use theirs, though you should find one for each of your guitars.

Really you are making this problem harder than it is, take a deep breath, relax, and find that wrench. After you get the nut off its easy to clean up in there and get things fitted right, but don't make things worse on yourself by routing out the channel.
You are correct sir. I do have an IBZ (an old 440RG) that uses an 8mm TRW though....back to this neck...I know that a 5/16 TRW does not fit. I have a set of nut drivers, the 7mm seems most likely to fit, but the wall is too thick by 0.01". Instead of hammering it in, I'd prefer to shave the metal some....

Unfortunately, I don't have a grinder handy, so it'll have to wait until next month and taking off 0.25mm with sand paper will take some time...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich View Post
Yup, I would have assumed you were using the correct Ibanez 7mm TRW.

But, I have had around 10 Ibanez over the years that you could not get a correct wrench on without either force, or routing the channel deeper. There are plenty out there.
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post #14 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 02:04 PM
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

It will tap on with a hammer, pulling the rod forward as it goes on. That will let you get the nut off, then decide which way to go to fix it.
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post #15 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 02:04 PM
 
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Re: Anyone care to put in their 2 cents on this one? Help Rich!!!

I had a similar problem on a 542R which has the same truss channel system as in the pic. I did exactly what the OP plans to do -- I took a 1/4" drive socket and thinned the walls enough to just slip over the nut. I believe I also had to scrape a little wood from just below the nut using an exacto blade.

BUT, then the socket handle couldn't fit into the socket due to how deeply the nut was recessed relative to the plane of the headstock. The solution to that was to drill a ~1/8" hole all the way through the socket to allow me to stick a nail in the hole and turn the socket without a ratchet or other handle. Actually, I think I drilled two holes at right angles to each other so that one or the other would always be accessible as I adjusted the nut. That socket is still around here somewhere with the nail taped to it.

The lingering question is: Why on earth did they build them this way in the first place? They only did it on a few models, and surely they could see that there was too little clearance around the nut.
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