Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge? - Jemsite
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post #1 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-10-2015, 11:10 PM Thread Starter
 
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Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge?

Hey,

I'm pretty new to floating terms in general, but I just lowered my string height while my strings are tuned normally, and I read that doing so would wear the post or the knife edge because of the high tension of the strings.

Is this a legit claim? I have read online and there has been people claiming that it doesn't wear at all, of that it does.

Also, the bridge is now lowered such that the sides of the knife edge cannot be seen, will that be a problem?

The trem is an original Ibanez Edge.
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post #2 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-11-2015, 10:26 AM
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

No, that's not true. You would not damage your guitar in any way but you can unscrew your locking nuts before change the height. You have to retune it anyway. Only by using the trem normally you increase and decrease tension a "hundred" times more. About the bridge height, thatīs not a problem too, but itīs not normal that you have to lower it that much. Whatīs going on? Too much relief on your neck??
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post #3 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-11-2015, 11:52 AM
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

Never change tremolo height on full tension.

It is very optimistic to claim no damage, when you spin one piece of metal against knife edge with cca 50kg tension between them?!
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post #4 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-11-2015, 11:57 AM
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

Yeah iīm a very optimistic person and maybe all my guitars are special
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post #5 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-11-2015, 12:13 PM
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

I recommend NEVER changing tremolo height on full tension. The weakest point of a tremolo is the knife edge. turning the post on full tension puts a lot of extra friction on the knife edge.

Then again, a lot also depends on the quality of your tremolo. I wouldn't recommend it on any newer tremolos. I have one from the 80's and it's built like a tank. Unfortunately, not many newer models have that quality
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post #6 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-11-2015, 12:16 PM
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

I have done that since my first Ibanez in 93, and never had a problem.
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post #7 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-11-2015, 12:39 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuga666 View Post
No, that's not true. You would not damage your guitar in any way but you can unscrew your locking nuts before change the height. You have to retune it anyway. Only by using the trem normally you increase and decrease tension a "hundred" times more. About the bridge height, thatīs not a problem too, but itīs not normal that you have to lower it that much. Whatīs going on? Too much relief on your neck??

I'm not sure.. I got this RG655 about a month ago. The neck looks relatively straight to me, with a SLIGHT gentle curve around the middle part of the neck.

The stock action was around 3mm I think, I dropped it to 2.5mm.
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post #8 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-11-2015, 04:28 PM
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

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Originally Posted by fluxthesky View Post
I'm not sure.. I got this RG655 about a month ago. The neck looks relatively straight to me, with a SLIGHT gentle curve around the middle part of the neck.

The stock action was around 3mm I think, I dropped it to 2.5mm.
It seems fine to me, thats exactly how i setup my guitars. If the edge bridge is a bit under the pickguard thats ok but if itīs buried in the wood i think something is wrong, at least i never had a guitar like that. BTW nice guitar
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post #9 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-11-2015, 05:07 PM
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

It won't damage your guitar to adjust string height while at pitch. In fact it helps to have it at pitch as you need the trem angle correct to get a feel for the actual string height.

A quick check of Rich's ibanez rules site tech page will confirm that it is safe.
Cheers.
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post #10 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-12-2015, 01:02 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

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Originally Posted by Tuga666 View Post
It seems fine to me, thats exactly how i setup my guitars. If the edge bridge is a bit under the pickguard thats ok but if itīs buried in the wood i think something is wrong, at least i never had a guitar like that. BTW nice guitar

Only the Edge of the knife edge is not visible, but the bridge is not buried in the wood.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lespauled View Post
I recommend NEVER changing tremolo height on full tension. The weakest point of a tremolo is the knife edge. turning the post on full tension puts a lot of extra friction on the knife edge.

Then again, a lot also depends on the quality of your tremolo. I wouldn't recommend it on any newer tremolos. I have one from the 80's and it's built like a tank. Unfortunately, not many newer models have that quality

Okay now I'm worried..
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post #11 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-12-2015, 05:49 AM
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

This is just my advice. Read my and other posts and decide yourself.

I would never change bridge height on full tension.

First of all, regarding height of tremolo, if you want to play fast you need some resistance from guitar.
You will play faster in medium high action then on (silly) low action. You need strings to fight back. If action is to low when you play very fast, like Vai or Malmsteen, to low action make strings become to soft. This is in case if you pick, but if your playing techniques like Stanley Jordan who exclusively taping on neck with no picking, then you need action low as you can achieve. That are two extremes, Tosin Abasi is probably in the middle.

Regarding changing bridge height on full tension,
if knife edge is proper condition, then you have ONE returning point,
so if You push bar down or pull up it will go back in same returning point,
and guitar will be always in tune.

If you have damaged knife edge, your returning point will split in TWO returning points, when you push bar down bridge will go back in lower returning point,
if you pull it up, it will return in higher returning point. It is not end of the world, and lot of guitars are perfectly playable in that condition, because you will tune it to one point and always return it to that point. Pro players are doing that all times.
This sound complicated but it is not. If you tune it in higher resting point, if you pull bar up it will return to higher resting point, and you do not have problem, if you push bar down you will not just let it rest on lower resting point, you will either on way back raise it slightly to jump to come back in upper resting point or put it in upper resting point by bending strings. If you do it few times deliberately, soon it will natural to you.

On quality bridges knife edge is very hard, so you can change bridge height on full tension few times without damage,
on softer bridges knife edge will be damaged faster if you change bridge height on full tension ,
and on too soft bridges, knife edge will be damaged with just regular use, even if you change action without tension.
Some players are using lipstick balm or similar as grease in place where posts and knife edges have contact.
Again, to claim no damage on rotating metal rod against sharp knife edge on full tension is er.. stupid.
People for centuries sharpen their knifes with piece of metal pressing(that is tension) against knife edge.

Last edited by peromucho7; 07-12-2015 at 06:29 AM.
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post #12 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-12-2015, 06:06 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

So did I in any way **** up my trem? I hope not..

I did a lot of adjustments though, but it's only minimal turns, maybe 1/4 of a round.
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post #13 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-12-2015, 11:20 AM
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

First, don't panic. You will know if there is anything wrong with the knife edge when you use the tremolo. If the knife edge is damaged, it won't come back to zero when using it. Pull up, and the strings will stay sharp after release, down and they will remain flat.

Odds are that you will be fine. Just check the tremolo, and remember to change height only AFTER releasing a lot of tension from the strings.
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post #14 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-12-2015, 01:04 PM
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

1. Your studs should be lubed
2. Any good quality system can and should be adjusted at full pitch.
3. Any questionable quality system is probably best to release a little tension.

In Ibanez the Edge, Lo Pro, Edge Pro, Edge Zero, EZ2, ZR can all be freely adjusted under tension.

TRS, Edge Pro 2, Edge 3 should not be adjusted under tension.
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post #15 of 43 (permalink) Old 07-12-2015, 01:07 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Does changing string height while strings are tuned normally damage the post/edge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich View Post
1. Your studs should be lubed
2. Any good quality system can and should be adjusted at full pitch.
3. Any questionable quality system is probably best to release a little tension.

In Ibanez the Edge, Lo Pro, Edge Pro, Edge Zero, EZ2, ZR can all be freely adjusted under tension.

TRS, Edge Pro 2, Edge 3 should not be adjusted under tension.
Well my guitar is an RG655, with an Original Edge bridge..
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