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post #1 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-13-2013, 02:02 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Leesburg, Virginia
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Clear Coating questions

Hello:

After almost 2 years putting my project on hold I decided to forget about veneer tops and bought a Mahogany replacement boby from a known vendor.

The body is looks great. I need to do a couple of minor adjustments.

Since it is a one piece mahogany and I love hoy the grain looks, I want to just clear coat it. It is my 1st project (actually my second, but I scrapped the 1st one, and use the parts on this one ), so here are my questions:

1. Before applying the clear coat, does the body needs a chemical preparation like a grain filler, sanding filler or both? Is it grain filler or sanding filler different names to describe the same type of product?

2. If yes to the previous question... How will that affect he grain color?

3. I will use f-hole decals on the body... What is the recommended sanding paper grit size to make the guitar even, so the edges of the decals can not be felt if you touch the guitar?

3. After the clear coat has built up and is dry, what is the best method to polish it and make it shinny? I have seen so many youtube videos and read so many things in this and other forums that I really don't know what should I do now.

Thanks
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post #2 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-13-2013, 03:10 PM
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota
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Re: Clear Coating questions

if you are putting a decal on it, I would fill the grain first. you can buy mahogany colored filler. If there is not a sanding sealer on the wood, do that 1st..


grain filler ( if you don't grain fill, the decal might look pitted)
sanding sealer, some guys use sanding sealer before and after the grain filler, I think that is if its oil based filler though.
sand with 600 or so sandpaper until smooth and flat
decal
clear coat a bunch of times, you have to build it up a bit..
make sure its cured.
sand with 600 then moving up grits until you are in the 1500 range. I have gone all the way to 2000. You can buy auto packs with a bunch of different grits.
then polish with a swirl remover,,
then with a wax
I use an orbital buffer for the polish and wax.

oops.. also you really have to build up that clear b/c of the decal. I did a PGM clone and even though the decal is only 1/2000 of an inch thick, it still took lots of clear and sanding that area back to get it flat.

Last edited by GUITARMAGEDDON; 05-13-2013 at 03:18 PM.
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post #3 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-13-2013, 03:24 PM
 
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Location: Plainfield, IL
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Re: Clear Coating questions

Have you ever cleared anything before?
Do you have an HVLP gun to do it (and a compressor to power it)?
Sanders - what kind of sanders and paper do you have?
Buffer? Do you have a high speed buffer with both Foam and Wool pads? Along with the appropriate compounds?

If your not setup with the right tools and equipment to do this - you'll spend more on that than having someone do it for you. Especially if you don't plan on doing it regularly.

Not to mention the possible screw up's you could have.

And as Guitarmageddon said - as thin as that decal might be - you will really have to do a lot of clearing, sand back, clearing, etc. to get it even so you don't see it.

Last edited by Rodzo; 05-13-2013 at 03:25 PM. Reason: spelling errors
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post #4 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-13-2013, 03:27 PM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodzo View Post
Have you ever cleared anything before?
Do you have an HVLP gun to do it (and a compressor to power it)?
Sanders - what kind of sanders and paper do you have?
Buffer? Do you have a high speed buffer with both Foam and Wool pads? Along with the appropriate compounds?

If your not setup with the right tools and equipment to do this - you'll spend more on that than having someone do it for you. Especially if you don't plan on doing it regularly.

Not to mention the possible screw up's you could have.

And as Guitarmageddon said - as thin as that decal might be - you will really have to do a lot of clearing, sand back, clearing, etc. to get it even so you don't see it.
I cleared the crap out of mine and you couldn't see it, but if you ran you finger over it , you could faintly feel the edge of the decal.. I just got sick of clearing and sanding and said eff it It still turned out great though.
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post #5 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-13-2013, 04:41 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by GUITARMAGEDDON View Post
if you are putting a decal on it, I would fill the grain first. you can buy mahogany colored filler. If there is not a sanding sealer on the wood, do that 1st..


grain filler ( if you don't grain fill, the decal might look pitted)
sanding sealer, some guys use sanding sealer before and after the grain filler, I think that is if its oil based filler though.
sand with 600 or so sandpaper until smooth and flat
decal
clear coat a bunch of times, you have to build it up a bit..
make sure its cured.
sand with 600 then moving up grits until you are in the 1500 range. I have gone all the way to 2000. You can buy auto packs with a bunch of different grits.
then polish with a swirl remover,,
then with a wax
I use an orbital buffer for the polish and wax.

oops.. also you really have to build up that clear b/c of the decal. I did a PGM clone and even though the decal is only 1/2000 of an inch thick, it still took lots of clear and sanding that area back to get it flat.
I'm also doing a PGM clone.

So I can interpret from your answer that grain filler is one thing and sanding sealer is another. Should I use both then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodzo View Post
Have you ever cleared anything before?
Do you have an HVLP gun to do it (and a compressor to power it)?
Sanders - what kind of sanders and paper do you have?
Buffer? Do you have a high speed buffer with both Foam and Wool pads? Along with the appropriate compounds?

If your not setup with the right tools and equipment to do this - you'll spend more on that than having someone do it for you. Especially if you don't plan on doing it regularly.

Not to mention the possible screw up's you could have.

And as Guitarmageddon said - as thin as that decal might be - you will really have to do a lot of clearing, sand back, clearing, etc. to get it even so you don't see it.
I have never cleared anything before.

I have the decals, the clear coat (cans), some sanding paper (600 is the thinnest I have), sanding block. I don't have anything else. It is my first project. That is why I am asking. What do I need to get then?
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post #6 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-13-2013, 06:34 PM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

sanding sealer does just what it says.. after the final sand, it seals the wood from whatever comes next. Grain filler is only used on porus woods to flatten out the plane. if you cleared over without filler, you will have pores all over in the finish. then when you try to polish the clear, the polish and wax will get stuck in the pours and turn into little white specs ( happened to me before)
You will need to fill the grain on this one.
What kind of clear coat are you using? I hear lots of people rave about he stuff make by 2K. It dried super fast. On my last few builds I used Deft Lacquer. Although its sprays nice, it took forever, and I mean months, to harden.
You wan to go very light coats of clear to build it up. Go too thick and it will frustrate you later

so get some grain filler, they make mahogany colored filler. apply, wipe, let dry, sand flat, then spray the body with sanding sealer. sand down the sealer when dry. not all the way through though. make sure the area for the decals is nice and flat and even. apply decals then start clearing with light coats. This is gonna be time consuming but worth it. Don't go thick with it. Some guys do a few coats and then sand a bit in between, but I just do it after every can and have never had a problem. Only thing is with the decals, you may have some extra sanding to do as a ridge will form where the decal meets the body. Lets start there for now we will worry abou the final sand, buff and shine later. Hope this helps!
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post #7 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-13-2013, 09:57 PM Thread Starter
 
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Location: Leesburg, Virginia
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Re: Clear Coating questions

Guitarmageddon, thanks for the Walkthrough.

This is the product I will use:



It was recommended to me by AlaskaBat in this forum. He said is his favorite, and he has done various projects. I will trust the man on this one. Like I said I have never done any of this before.

I remembered your RPG Project, The Black & Red you posted here.

I have an Original PGM 100 (From 1991 or '92) that a so called professional luthier messed up. If this custom build goes as planned I am thinking about doing the restoration on the Original PGM myself. Although I should not, but I trusted someone who does that for a living once, and the results were not pleasant. That is why I decided not to trust any one anymore with my guitars and learn to do things myself.
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post #8 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-14-2013, 08:24 AM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

I've heard good things about that Krylon stuff too! Actually I should try that. A-bat has done some really impressive builds and I would definitely trust him on this one.

That sucks about what happened to the PGM!! I hope it come out great when you redo it. When I started, it was switching out pickup b/c I didn't want to pay a shop to do it,, few years later and I'm building my own bodies.
once you get the refinishing down, its really fun and rewarding. Please make a thread when you start the project! build threads are my fave
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post #9 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-14-2013, 08:28 AM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

I'd be willing to bet that will yellow over time. I also bet it won't cure as hard as a 2 part automotive clear...

But for your first project, and to get the hang of things - hey - why not. Especially if your doing it for yourself and not customers.
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post #10 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-14-2013, 08:43 AM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

is there anything close to 2pt. atuo clear that comes in a rattle can? Like, something from an auto parts store? I've used auto paints before on guitars but never a clear.
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post #11 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-14-2013, 09:33 AM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by GUITARMAGEDDON View Post
is there anything close to 2pt. atuo clear that comes in a rattle can? Like, something from an auto parts store? I've used auto paints before on guitars but never a clear.
This works great.



http://www.cjponyparts.com/product.a...FfE7MgodOnQArQ
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post #12 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-14-2013, 09:44 AM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

I wish I could find this stuff locally.. 22 bucks plus shipping!!!
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post #13 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-14-2013, 11:47 AM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

I'd love to try the 2K automotive clear also, but yes it seems pricey. It should be noted, though, it's worth multiple cans of the others, as it has much more 'solids' than say polyurethane. Poly has at least 50% by volume of solvents. My understanding is that this stuff has far less thinners, and hence builds faster. If you try the 2K, please let us know your experiences.
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post #14 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-14-2013, 12:18 PM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewgosline View Post
I'd love to try the 2K automotive clear also, but yes it seems pricey. It should be noted, though, it's worth multiple cans of the others, as it has much more 'solids' than say polyurethane. Poly has at least 50% by volume of solvents. My understanding is that this stuff has far less thinners, and hence builds faster. If you try the 2K, please let us know your experiences.
hmm.. good to know!
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post #15 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-14-2013, 01:49 PM
 
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Re: Clear Coating questions

Pass on the 5$ rattle cans.


http://www.amazon.com/USC-Spray-Glos...y+max+2k+clear


this will get you a professional clear coat, and wont be soft for the next 3 years.


edit: FFS RYC! I didnt even see your post lmao.


edit 2: heres some outcomes of mine with those 2k rattle cans





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