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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-10-2004, 09:54 PM Thread Starter
 
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String Buzz

After seeing G3 up in Kansas City a couple months back I decided I needed to pick up the guitar again. I pulled out my guitars as well as went out and bought a 77FP and proceeded to put them in top playing condition. I have followed all the advice on set-up from Ibanez Rules and followed some of it from this site and everything is great. But I am having one problem on all four of my guitars; with .5 mm of relief and 2 mm action at 24 on Low E and 1.7-1.9 on High E, everything is great except I get buzzing on frets 12-15 on Low E & A. On every guitar. All else will be fine except for that. I have been working away at this for like three weeks trying everything and can't fix it. The only thing I haven't tried is shimming the nut or the neck pocket cause it does not seem to be the problem. Just these 8 frets and maybe a little on 12-15 on D which I fix with raising the bridge. But the only way I can get it out of the E & A is to jack up the action to like 3 mm on Low E (that's how high my JEM's action had when I got it straight from Sam Ash) and that is just unacceptable to me. Please help!
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 02:21 AM
 
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It's give and take, my guitars will buzz a bit in about the same positions on the same strings with this kind of setup. (I've gone with higher action lately, so I no longer have this "problem".)

With this amount of relief and 2.0 mm action on the low-E your strings (depending on how smooth the bow is on the neck) can be almost parallel to the fretboard from about fret 12 or 15 to the 24th, so buzz is going to happen to some extent.

Play at your normal volume through your amp, just PLAY, don't play those strings unless it's called for in what your playing and see if it's tolerable, or even noticeable.

Sometimes when we're checking for buzz we'll pick a little harder than what's 'normal' when we play. I've checked guitars like this and realized I was really digging into the strings a lot harder than I usually do, I backed off and just played and found the guitar didn't buzz at all.

Now, if the strings DO buzz too much for your taste when you just "PLAY", a fret level may be in order, or you may have to learn to live with slightly higher action.

If you have a heavy hand, I'd say try the higher action. Less buzz, better tone (subjective) and personally, now that I'm used to it I like having the strings fight me a little. I feel like I'm playing something, something that's pushing back and making me work to play my best.

My technique has actually improved quite a bit since I raised my action, but that's me. :-)

Mic
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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 02:26 AM
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I used to hate high action, but now I love it, cause in my opinion, you can "feel" the guitar more. sweeping and arpegios are a lot easier now for me. Kind of off topic, but maybe it will sway your opinion on whether or not you will raise your action more, to get rid of the buzz. I would just give it a try.
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 11:14 AM
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2mm is low action, of course you're going to get buzz unless your technique is light and perfect [and actually you can go much lower with light and perfect]. Typically most of the relief is toward the nut so you're hearing the buzz where the neck is straightening out. The higher up the neck you go the less you hear it because it's turning to compressed action on the uppermost frets, that's why you don't hear the buzz as much [or not as buzz anyway].
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 11:57 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich
2mm is low action, of course you're going to get buzz unless your technique is light and perfect [and actually you can go much lower with light and perfect]. Typically most of the relief is toward the nut so you're hearing the buzz where the neck is straightening out. The higher up the neck you go the less you hear it because it's turning to compressed action on the uppermost frets, that's why you don't hear the buzz as much [or not as buzz anyway].
Isn't that about the same thing that I said, only I used a LOT more words? :P (we should have an emoticon that is winking with the tongue sticking out.)

Mic
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 12:04 PM
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I didn't catch where you mentioned it turns to comressed the higher you go [too many words for me to read!] but if you did :hat-tip:
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 12:16 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MicJustMic
With this amount of relief and 2.0 mm action on the low-E your strings (depending on how smooth the bow is on the neck) can be almost parallel to the fretboard from about fret 12 or 15 to the 24th, so buzz is going to happen to some extent.
I just didn't use the word "compressed". :-)

I over-explain very often.

Mic
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 01:32 PM
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Then you should have overexplained more
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 02:28 PM Thread Starter
 
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My technique is pretty light and clean, and when I pick lightly I really don't get the buzz. I am checking for buzz on my clean channel and the only way I can really get away with harder picking up high is when I'm on my bridge pickup. But If I try to get away with that using any of the other pick ups there's no way.
Rich, you consider 2mm low. Like I stated ealier, my JEMM 77FP came with like 3mm action. Is this normal on a JEM? Am I wanting to much when I say I want 2mm action? I'm sure I sound totally ignorant, and I am when it comes to guitars; I'm really a bass player. I've pleayed bass primarily for the last 19 years, but have always had a guitar that I messed around on. With the bass I have never worried about buzz or action as it has never been an issue. I don't even know what the action is on my basses but it's definately higher than 2mm. I wonder what Mr. Vai's action is set at?
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 02:36 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reishiman
I wonder what Mr. Vai's action is set at?
If you look on Steve's web page, in the section called "All About Evo" you'll see his action is about 4mm or higher at the 24th fret.

I can't go that high, I'm at about 2.7 and 2.0 (low to high) now.

Steve's an animal though. With those big hands he can handle action that high.

Mic
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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reishiman
Rich, you consider 2mm low. Like I stated ealier, my JEMM 77FP came with like 3mm action. Is this normal on a JEM?
Depending on where you bought it it's most likely the only "setup" it got was when the parts were assembled at the factory.
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