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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 11-24-2002, 04:03 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 105
mode application : the thread lol

Hey im close to actually getting this thing now
I just wana ask you something with an example. If you had vamp chord prgression of Cmaj then Dmaj so Cmaj for a while then Dmaj, what exactly could you play on it and why? also can you play say Cmajs modes like F lydian on top of the Dmaj scale.
I now get modes but its application that want to understand now
thanks

PS i probably need to learn somthing about mode application before asking this qustion so feel free to tell me to look at something else, before ask this lol
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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 11-24-2002, 04:48 PM
Ash
 
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ok! lets see if i can help!

first off: the 7 modes are simply the 7 notes of the major scale played starting on different roots. (just to make sure we understand this )

now lets see: Cmaj and Dmaj what do we know? Cmaj notes - C,E,G . Dmaj notes - D,#F,A .
for Cmaj, since it uses notes that are all in the Cmaj scale and its roots, you can use any mode deriven from the C major scale.
for Dmaj, you could use any mode deriven from the Dmaj scale. simple enough? now, there are ways to bend the rules, you could play the G major scale over Cmaj, etc. but that's more advanced.

no, you can not play the F lydian mode over the Dmaj chord ( i assume you mean chord?) because F lydan is part of C major (C,D,E,F,G,A,B) and Dmaj is part of D major (C#,D,E,F#,G,A,B). the F# in the chord would clash with the F in the scale. if you're starting out i'm sure your familiar with what that sounds like!

anyway, hope this helps you with your jamming! try to find someone who understands this to jam with, that way you could learn by doing instead of taking someones word for it! besides, it's more fun!
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 06:51 AM
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Istanbul, TURKEY
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As I see it,

We have C - D chords. Tonally thinking, two major chords ,sequentially, exist only in the IV - V degrees of a major scale harmony. So it looks like the tone is G major (or E minor).

In a straightforward approach, I would play C lydian over C and D mixolydian over the D chord.
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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-19-2002, 08:45 AM
 
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That's no way to get your name on the local newspaper.

C mixolydian b6 (c, d, e, f, g, ab, bb) and D alt (d, eb, f, gb, ab, bb, c) all the way baby.

Remember to superimpose some of those fancy string-skipping arpeggios on the vamp while you're at it!
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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-19-2002, 08:52 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Courjan
In a straightforward approach, I would play C lydian over C and D mixolydian over the D chord.
Just gotta add:
Why didn't you just tell the dude to wail G major all over it? Or G maj pentatonic for the love of what's-his-name? That'd be straightforward.

Why didn't I tell that myself? Well, because I'm a dick who's studied music far too much. What a pinhead I am. And I don't even think of scales when I play. My brain's too slow for that. Gotta trust my ears that are shot. So who am I to say "cheese noodles"? Geeezz.
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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-19-2002, 11:12 AM Thread Starter
 
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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-19-2002, 03:42 PM Thread Starter
 
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ok so leme get this staight with a new example. Supposing you had a IIm7, V7 progression

Am7, D9 Am7, D9
Gm7, C9, Gm7, C9

what could you play on that, i think i know but i wana know if its right

thanks alot for this
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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-23-2002, 04:54 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bar_Hook
ok so leme get this staight with a new example. Supposing you had a IIm7, V7 progression

Am7, D9 Am7, D9
Gm7, C9, Gm7, C9

what could you play on that, i think i know but i wana know if its right

thanks alot for this
Am7-D9? G major all the way babes. If you wanna go easy.
Gm7-C9? F major. Ditto. Or the maj pentatonic.

If you wanna do it the hard way, well. You can first figure out the chord tones (Am7: A, C, E, G. D9: D, F#, A, C, E) and then check out all the scales that include those notes. E.g. G major includes those. This is the essential point of the revered chord-scale theory. Lo and behold!

If they sound "good" or "right" is strictly a matter of your phrasing ability and confidence, as known as BALLS.

For Am7 you could use A ionian, dorian, phrygian, dorian b2... as they all include the Am7 chord tones. E.g. A dorian, A, B, C, D, E, F#, G. You have the chord tones in the scale, all that's between (4th, 6th, 2nd) is just for adding colour. Same process of analysis with D9. I bet yougetthepictcha.

BUT. Really no jazz cat thinks it that way. The trick of hip sheité is chords over chords. That's right, you heard right. The rhythm section is already playing those chord changes, so WHY ON EARTH SHOULD YOU? You can make up your own changes. This is the ultimate-pinhead method of superimposing arpeggios. Watch and learn.

On Am7, f.ex. Cmaj7 is safe and cool. C, E, G, B. That's almost like your Am7 chord (if you don't remember that one, look back a number of rows). The only thing that's different is that B. On Am7 it's a 9th. Everyone knows a min9 sounds kewl.

I could present a system of arpeggios over a 4-part chord, ranging from "very consonant" i.e. "inside" to "very dissonant" i.e. "out", but I'm lazy and it'd be a long post. So, I say: EXPERIMENT. And TRANSCRIBE.
Go shred it. Just watch that you land on a chord tone and you'll be safe.
Use your EARS.

An exaple to chew on: On IIm7b5-V7-Imaj7 in C [Dm7b5, G7, Cmaj7] try Abmaj7#5, Db7, Cmaj7#4. Write some lines, use some nice airy intervals like 6ths and 4ths instead of just playing arpeggios straigth through. See what you can come up with. The transpose your new favorite licks to 12 keys. Learn 'em good, stick 'em into your solos. So there, that should keep ya busy during the holidays...

Dear Lord did I drivel away again. Maybe I should start teaching the next generation of shred-o-matics. How about that?!?
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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 01-01-2003, 12:43 PM Thread Starter
 
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Posts: 105
thanks so much for that reply it straightened alot out for me; you should teach lol
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