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post #16 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-12-2008, 08:53 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by ixelion View Post
Sorry for my ignorance but:

These are power amps and pre amps right? I wont have to buy a separate preamp section?
no he's just an idiot. his post makes 0 sense.
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post #17 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-12-2008, 08:56 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by Gudster View Post
Marshall TSL.
High gain, yes, many tone options, yes - doesn't sound even remotely like a 5:25 though - try before you buy if the Mesa took your fancy as this is a very different (but still very good) beast.
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post #18 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-12-2008, 10:35 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

Cracks me up when people bag on Mesa. I've owned several and currently gig a Lonestar weekly. Couldn't be happier.
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post #19 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-12-2008, 10:47 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

Well I am not looking for the absolute best even if some might believe that the 5:25 may have some short comings, I believe my overall experience could largely be positive.

Mind you I am upgrading from a tiny 5w tube so I'm pretty sure my inexperienced ears will be blown away by any high gain tube amp :P

Also I am not necessarily looking for something that sounds like a 5:25, just something with a whole lotta gain.

Lastly I am not sure something like a 100W/50W switchable wattage is what I need, mainly because I would like to use a high power setting say 40W-120W for gigs and something like 5W-25W for recording purposes, short of buying two separate amps (unless you guys think buying two separate amps is a better solution?)

I am inexperienced, but I believe that the "lower power" setting for some of these amps rages from like 50W-60W which may be excessive for recording?
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post #20 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-12-2008, 10:55 PM
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by elcid View Post
Doesnt your dad have 37 vintage Mesas from the 1920s that sound great?
nah he has a 67 ab165 bassman blackface with the origionla cab, i think its a 67 pretty sure it is

Quote:
Originally Posted by David McCarroll View Post
..... cool, yeah, I know - I own two of them so I experience all these problems first hand - don't know why I bought them really........
hey now, some people love them, but if u bypass the preamp section and use a processor like the vox tonelab or the digitech 2120, you can hear the difference, but like my buddy gots one and he loves it, im not saying they are terrible amps per say for someones taste, but ive heard from people they get way too hot, and if u use it alot the caps burn up, the trannys might shift in pitch due to heat....thats just what ive heard, and when i play my preamp through a peavey, he reponse time is greater, you can hear the difference, ive tried going through a messa before, not my gig, but some people love em

Quote:
Originally Posted by ixelion View Post
Sorry for my ignorance but:

These are power amps and pre amps right? I wont have to buy a separate preamp section?
yeah they are poweramps only, but the best part is, you can use anything, personaly peo[ple here rant about the messa, but for its preamp, id take a carvin quad x-amp over any messa tube preamp, and the carvins are all switchable, hand wired, not made anymore, but the tone surpasses the messa preamps and are more modded by far!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by David McCarroll View Post
yes they are power amps - you need a separate pre-amp to get anything other than a giant super clean tone out of them. and to answer the last question on losgatosrg350dx's original post, I have a Mesa 2:90 power amp which delivers humungous clean tone up to ear-bleeding volume, but of course purely sucks in parts, assembly, componenets and response time, and seems to have all this odd buzzing, fizzing and fuzzing going on ........

Apologies for being a bit fascetious (sic), but I actually PLAY through Mesa gear, at home, on gigs and in the studio, so I know what they do and what they sound like on a day to day basis, rather than what is said about them on various forums....

Again, the 5:25 is a fantastic amp - you have already stated that yourself, I really would suggest you keep saving, have a look at second hand ones etc - otherwise you will be settling for a compromise on what you are really looking for.
if it were a versus front to front, a messa 2:90, has absolutely nothing on a 60/60...and when u wana talk about humongous tone, a 120/120, would drown out a 2:90 in a heartbeat and is SOOOOOO freaking less expensive than a messa 2:90 and lasts longer, runns smoother, and sounds better, even without all the darn presence controls/solo controls, with the peavey you never need it, and there are many kits u can get for peavey rack amps for switching power right in the middle of playing it even, that way you can run for instance a mono 60 rack amp at half power and then press a foot switch and get full 60 watts...thats better than the 12 db solo switch on the messa(12db maybe something else, i just know its a volume switch)

and if u wana talk about comprimise i personaly dont think for a heartbeat in quality that a messa is buit better than a peavey rack amp, a old one that is

Quote:
Originally Posted by markyperfection View Post
yeah, because somebody looking for a high-gain amp with switchable wattage is going to be able make really good use of a rack-mounted power amp without a pre-amp section.


great advice, dude. is there anybody on jemsite who knows less about what they're talking about than you? i'd love to read that guy's posts.
like i said before, i almost got my tech to do a pwer switchable feature on my amp, but never got around to it, and i dont need it, i have a awesome preamp now

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadRyan View Post
Cracks me up when people bag on Mesa. I've owned several and currently gig a Lonestar weekly. Couldn't be happier.
well lets see...ive tried messa, and they dont have that death metal technical metal sound
i play alot of shuldiner, sucimez, metallica, dimebag, and in that kind, and ive never been able to get a tone from a messa anything near the dimebag crisp, nor the shuldiner crystal mountain....

even with effects...now i mentioned, some of you may like it, but i dont, and ive just heard alot about them that isnt good, my buddy alan, worked in the messa store in hollywood, and did it, just to get a ampo at discount, and after working there, he saw soo many returns, servicing, etc....so all my stuff is based on what a semi-pro amp tech has told me

but if u have a chpoise to go with a preamp and power amp selection, this way you can match ur sound alot better, and spend fortunes less for better built equipement, then id suggest the peavey rack power amp, a trully superb workhorse that eats the current competition

other than a engl, sorry a engl with eat anything
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post #21 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-12-2008, 10:59 PM
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ixelion View Post
Well I am not looking for the absolute best even if some might believe that the 5:25 may have some short comings, I believe my overall experience could largely be positive.

Mind you I am upgrading from a tiny 5w tube so I'm pretty sure my inexperienced ears will be blown away by any high gain tube amp :P

Also I am not necessarily looking for something that sounds like a 5:25, just something with a whole lotta gain.

Lastly I am not sure something like a 100W/50W switchable wattage is what I need, mainly because I would like to use a high power setting say 40W-120W for gigs and something like 5W-25W for recording purposes, short of buying two separate amps (unless you guys think buying two separate amps is a better solution?)

I am inexperienced, but I believe that the "lower power" setting for some of these amps rages from like 50W-60W which may be excessive for recording?

i dont think a valve king would be sufficiant in tone, thier transformers donthandle as well as a 5150 for instance or a 6505
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post #22 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 08:11 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

Quote:
Originally Posted by losgatosrg350dx View Post

Blah Blah Blah... Blah Blah Blah...

well lets see...ive tried messa, and they dont have that death metal technical metal sound
i play alot of shuldiner, sucimez, metallica, dimebag, and in that kind, and ive never been able to get a tone from a messa anything near the dimebag crisp, nor the shuldiner crystal mountain....

Blah Blah Blah... Blah Blah Blah...

other than a engl, sorry a engl with eat anything
I suppose it never occurred to you that the examples of music you're citing are pretty much crappy speed metal type tones. I liked Dimebag's playing, saw them a couple times live in the mid 90's and all that, but his tone was utter crap. As for Metallica... The tones they had on AJFA were pure Boogie Mark IIC+ and or Mark III's. That's what they were playing at the time.

I play a Lonestar, which if you didn't know is a two channel amp with pretty much the best clean channel anywhere and a standard Mesa mid/high gain channel. It's really smooth, thick, chewy type tones and feel. It's most definitely not Metal. I used to play Metal. I had a horde of rack gear I packed around. I got bored with metal. I started playing Blues/soul. I now play out weekly and enjoy myself. In fact I'm off to practice in a few minutes.

As for Engl... They're cool amps. I've played a few, but they're not my thing. My VHT Deliverance would eat most amps for playing metal, but I'm not trying to pass it off as the be-all end-all for everyone.

As you age (mature) and you eventually get bored with banging on the low E (Or B if you're a new-metal guy) you'll start to see that there's a whole world full of music out there to be appreciated, and you'll start looking for different gear to get that ever evolving sound you hear in your head.

Peace...
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post #23 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 08:51 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

Quote:
if it were a versus front to front, a messa 2:90, has absolutely nothing on a 60/60...and when u wana talk about humongous tone, a 120/120, would drown out a 2:90 in a heartbeat and is SOOOOOO freaking less expensive than a messa 2:90 and lasts longer, runns smoother, and sounds better, even without all the darn presence controls/solo controls, with the peavey you never need it, and there are many kits u can get for peavey rack amps for switching power right in the middle of playing it even, that way you can run for instance a mono 60 rack amp at half power and then press a foot switch and get full 60 watts...thats better than the 12 db solo switch on the messa(12db maybe something else, i just know its a volume switch)
while i agree that the peaveys are great, i have (2) 60/60s, the boogie poweramp section still sounds better to me. i'm talking about mark series amps here. i'm also running tube preamps into these, so no solidstate.
also, there are no "kits" that i know of to drop the wattage of any amp on the fly. all the pedals that claim to do this only drop the volume, not change the output. there is a huge difference between the two. mesa had it built into the 395s. but it's not dropping to 1 watt in the power section. the new egnaters have individual power scaling per channel which is cool.
judging by the bands you like the sounds of, i can see why some of the mesa amps wont do it for you. but just about any boogie can sound great with a good player.
i'm not a mesa snob by any means. i have soldano, peavey, metaltronix etc..they all have their place. but my mesa does sound great. and yes, i have played a carvin quad preamp. no comparison to the boogie quad imho.
that's what makes amps so special, everyone has different tastes.
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post #24 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 09:00 PM
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by hirah View Post
while i agree that the peaveys are great, i have (2) 60/60s, the boogie poweramp section still sounds better to me. i'm talking about mark series amps here. i'm also running tube preamps into these, so no solidstate.
also, there are no "kits" that i know of to drop the wattage of any amp on the fly. all the pedals that claim to do this only drop the volume, not change the output. there is a huge difference between the two. mesa had it built into the 395s. but it's not dropping to 1 watt in the power section. the new egnaters have individual power scaling per channel which is cool.
judging by the bands you like the sounds of, i can see why some of the mesa amps wont do it for you. but just about any boogie can sound great with a good player.
i'm not a mesa snob by any means. i have soldano, peavey, metaltronix etc..they all have their place. but my mesa does sound great. and yes, i have played a carvin quad preamp. no comparison to the boogie quad imho.
that's what makes amps so special, everyone has different tastes.


i dont know any places that have those peavey kits

but i do know they exsist i got a estimate on my amp was about 200 to have it installed minus the foot peal

and its just a bypass for the choke and the power section, and instantly drops it down...actually i had a choice if i remember correclty

its not a pedal the changed the volume or the db

the volume input on the peavey stays at high all the for instance
and the heaters and stack voltage going to the tubes remains the same always
the footswitch just atenuates the transformer and the choke, thats what i thought it was

but yeah howd u like the carvin quad amp preamp unit...??

but i dont know if i ever use the switchable voltages ever on amps, i think i more or less play with my 2120 artist more, wich is loaded with spaceaged features :-)
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post #25 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 10:05 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by David McCarroll View Post
High gain, yes, many tone options, yes - doesn't sound even remotely like a 5:25 though - try before you buy if the Mesa took your fancy as this is a very different (but still very good) beast.
Aye, to be honest I only read the thread title. It's a good amp, definitely worth checking out, but its sounds nothing like a Mesa (speaking from my own experience, I went from a Triple Rectifier to a TSL).
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post #26 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 10:19 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by ixelion View Post

Lastly I am not sure something like a 100W/50W switchable wattage is what I need, mainly because I would like to use a high power setting say 40W-120W for gigs and something like 5W-25W for recording purposes, short of buying two separate amps (unless you guys think buying two separate amps is a better solution?)

Again on the Marshall TSL, press of a button takes you from 100 Watts to 25. I'd say definitely try one out first though, it really is chalk and cheese compared to most Mesas tone wise. Its a great middle of the road amp. The lead channel gives you tons of gain and the crunch channel sounds great dialed up and down depending on what sort of songs you are playing. You get those Marshall "dirty" cleans too for some great scratchy strumming depending on where you have the clean gain set.
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post #27 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 11:33 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by elcid View Post
Doesnt your dad have 37 vintage Mesas from the 1920s that sound great?
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post #28 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 11:40 PM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by ixelion View Post

Lastly I am not sure something like a 100W/50W switchable wattage is what I need, mainly because I would like to use a high power setting say 40W-120W for gigs and something like 5W-25W for recording purposes, short of buying two separate amps (unless you guys think buying two separate amps is a better solution?)

I am inexperienced, but I believe that the "lower power" setting for some of these amps rages from like 50W-60W which may be excessive for recording?
Oddly enough, you've probably got it the wrong way around - if you are onstage in a mic'ed up situation, running a 5:25 absolutely flat chat on the 5 watt setting will make the average front of house guy love you forever - pledge his first born to you, that sort of thing...... even a Vox AC30 running flat chat will get you closed down in almost any normal sized venue in Sydney!

On the flip side, in a proper acoustically isolated recording studio, you can run any amp as hard as you want - you just want to be sitting in the control room, not the studio, while you are doing so!

Slash used to record with a setup he called "the feedback generator" - this was him sitting in the control room playing in front of a Boogie (MK4 maybe?) running not terribly loud, but with ridiculous amounts of gain, while in the actual studio was a Marshall 100watt setup running flat chat - the Boogie would drive the guitar into endless sustain and feedback, but the recorded tone was classic mid gain Marshall, but with all the feedback and sustain that the boogie was forcing out of the guitar - nifty eh, and far less damaging on the ears
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post #29 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 12:05 AM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

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Originally Posted by losgatosrg350dx View Post

yeah they are poweramps only, but the best part is, you can use anything, personaly peo[ple here rant about the messa, but for its preamp, id take a carvin quad x-amp over any messa tube preamp, and the carvins are all switchable, hand wired, not made anymore, but the tone surpasses the messa preamps and are more modded by far!!!
Interesting you should say that - I swapped a Carvin Quad-X pre-amp which I absolutely loathed (okay, it was a BAD, budget driven decision!) for the TriAxis I now use - a classic example to me of choosing second best from the start, then compounding that bad decision by losing a fortune when I finally flicked the stupid thing!
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post #30 of 43 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 12:12 AM
 
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Re: High gain amp with switchable wattage?

Oh, yeah, the Quad-X had two passable clean channels, a totally unuseable "crunch" channel, and a "lead" channel which my colleagues referred to as "the mosquito", was supplied from the shop with at best a semi-working footswitch which eventually packed in completely, resulting in me running the whole shebang with a vastly complicated thing called a Peavey MIDI Manager and the equally bizarre Event to Real Time Controller (a box of relays) - this thing had to be programmed in hexadecimal language! All this because even though Carvin loudly proclaimed the Quad-X to be "MIDI programmable, it was in fact nothing of the sort (in fact it had NO direct MIDI interface at all - blatant false advertising!). I was forever picking up knobs and switch tips which fell off the front panel at gigs.....

It might be far more modded by far, but that didn't stop it from being a complete piece of junk.

In fact this absolutely horrible bit of work put me off Carvin gear forever, and hence I won't go near anything they do, guitars, amps, speakers, nothing!
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