Need help buying a good amplifier for metal - Jemsite
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post #1 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 12:31 PM Thread Starter
 
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Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

Hi guys, I've been looking around the internet for quite sometime now, and I just can't decide which amp should I buy. At first I thought of buying the Bugera 6262-212 combo, which is a 120W amp, but since I'm going to be using it 90% of the time in my bedroom people kept telling me I won't be able to enjoy the real sound of it until I crank up the volume on it, which is not possible [unless I let my ears bleed maybe?]. I really don't know how loud is it going to sound even if the volume knob is at 1.
So if you guys could just help me out with buying an amp, it would be much appreciated. My budget is around $900, I would stretch it to $1000 if you think a processor is necessary. Thank you once again.


These are some of the other amplifiers I've been considering -

Peavey 6505+ Combo 112 (60W) - It's a 60W amp so I don't really know if this will be really LOUD.

Peavey Vypyr 30W/75W

Line 6 Spider IV 30W/75W


Please someone get me out of my misery, I haven't played my guitar for 2 weeks now because I'm so confused and frustrated what to buy!
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post #2 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:01 PM
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

How much would an 11Rack and a Tech 21 Power Engine cost in India?

Jimmy
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post #3 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:05 PM
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

All of those amps can get loud. You are correct in that turning the tube amps way down kills their tone.

If you aren't in a band and are planning on playing 90% of the time in your bedroom, a processor might be a better way to go for now. Most modern processors have many amp models in them, allowing you to experiment with different tones/sounds/fx etc. Also you can play through headphones and/or setup direct recording w/ your PC easier than trying to mic up an amp.

So it just depends what you really want to do. If you plan on gigging/jamming go with a real amp. If you plan on bedroom practicing/recording go with a processor. You can always get an amp later and use the processor with it so based on your description I'd prob get the processor first.

Last edited by kfssdude; 09-13-2012 at 01:10 PM.
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post #4 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:13 PM Thread Starter
 
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Red face Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

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Originally Posted by jb4674 View Post
How much would an 11Rack and a Tech 21 Power Engine cost in India?

Jimmy
sadly it'll have to be shipped in from the USA since it's not available here, which would add about $200-300$ shipping cost

Last edited by dennisdurairaj; 09-13-2012 at 01:22 PM.
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post #5 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:22 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

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Originally Posted by kfssdude View Post
All of those amps can get loud. You are correct in that turning the tube amps way down kills their tone.

If you aren't in a band and are planning on playing 90% of the time in your bedroom, a processor might be a better way to go for now. Most modern processors have many amp models in them, allowing you to experiment with different tones/sounds/fx etc. Also you can play through headphones and/or setup direct recording w/ your PC easier than trying to mic up an amp.

So it just depends what you really want to do. If you plan on gigging/jamming go with a real amp. If you plan on bedroom practicing/recording go with a processor. You can always get an amp later and use the processor with it so based on your description I'd prob get the processor first.

Right now I connect my guitar to my PC via an audio interface and use amp sims like the LePou plugins + Redwirez impulses on Cubase 5, I'm not very happy with the tone out of them, especially when you compare them to the amps I mentioned above.
So you're telling me to use amp sims from a processor and feed it into my AI, then use a cab simulator?
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post #6 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:27 PM
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

Out of the list you gave the Vypyr is the best choice.
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post #7 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:29 PM
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

Quote:
Originally Posted by dennisdurairaj View Post
Right now I connect my guitar to my PC via an audio interface and use amp sims like the LePou plugins + Redwirez impulses on Cubase 5, I'm not very happy with the tone out of them, especially when you compare them to the amps I mentioned above.
So you're telling me to use amp sims from a processor and feed it into my AI, then use a cab simulator?
Personally, I have not been impressed by most of the PC amp sim plug-ins I've tried. I think the mid-to-high end processors sound a lot better than plug-ins.

But more importantly what I'm telling you is that the amps you are considering will not sound very good at bedroom levels. The difference between 120w & 60w amp is only about 6dB... They are still very loud! Even a 15w amp can scream. Tube amps have the best tone, undoubtedly, but the physics governing how a vacuum tube works dictates that it needs to be turned up to at least a moderate level to generate its "true" tone. I just don't think you'll be happy with them turned way down to bedroom levels. Tube amps choked off like that sound thin & crappy.

Up to you though!
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post #8 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:30 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

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Out of the list you gave the Vypyr is the best choice.
Great thanks, but do you have any other suggestions?
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post #9 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:35 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

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Originally Posted by kfssdude View Post
Personally, I have not been impressed by most of the PC amp sim plug-ins I've tried. I think the mid-to-high end processors sound a lot better than plug-ins.

But more importantly what I'm telling you is that the amps you are considering will not sound very good at bedroom levels. The difference between 120w & 60w amp is only about 6dB... They are still very loud! Even a 15w amp can scream. Tube amps have the best tone, undoubtedly, but the physics governing how a vacuum tube works dictates that it needs to be turned up to at least a moderate level to generate its "true" tone. I just don't think you'll be happy with them turned way down to bedroom levels. Tube amps choked off like that sound thin & crappy.

Up to you though!

Hmm if that's the case, do you think its better if I get say a 15W amp + a mid-high end processor[could you suggest 1?]
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post #10 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:48 PM
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

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Hmm if that's the case, do you think its better if I get say a 15W amp + a mid-high end processor[could you suggest 1?]
An excellent question that I am unfortunately not very well qualified to answer. I am a tube amp guy and play through loud tube amps. I own 3 Mesas (Road King, Dual Rec, Mark V), Peavy 5150 1st gen, Carvin Legacy 3, Fender 5150 III, Egnater, Orange, Soldano, Laney & more... I love tone chasing with tube amps! But as an experienced tube amp guy I'm just tryin to share that, as awesome as these amps can sound, they are definitely NOT bedroom amps.

I use minimal fx so I just use a Boss GT10 through the fx loop... I'm not a hard core processor guy. But even my little GT10 sounds better than most of the plug-ins I've tried. I would defer processor judgment to the guys experienced with the Axe FX models, 11Rack, etc. Those guys could tell you a lot more about high end processors than I can.

Sorry if my "advice" seems less than helpful. Just didn't want you to spend $1k on a nice tube amp just to be disappointed by its bedroom tones.
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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 01:58 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

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Originally Posted by kfssdude View Post
An excellent question that I am unfortunately not very well qualified to answer. I am a tube amp guy and play through loud tube amps. I own 3 Mesas (Road King, Dual Rec, Mark V), Peavy 5150 1st gen, Carvin Legacy 3, Fender 5150 III, Egnater, Orange, Soldano, Laney & more... I love tone chasing with tube amps! But as an experienced tube amp guy I'm just tryin to share that, as awesome as these amps can sound, they are definitely NOT bedroom amps.

I use minimal fx so I just use a Boss GT10 through the fx loop... I'm not a hard core processor guy. But even my little GT10 sounds better than most of the plug-ins I've tried. I would defer processor judgment to the guys experienced with the Axe FX models, 11Rack, etc. Those guys could tell you a lot more about high end processors than I can.

Sorry if my "advice" seems less than helpful. Just didn't want you to spend $1k on a nice tube amp just to be disappointed by its bedroom tones.

First of all, I gotta say, you have a jaw dropping collection of tube amps there !!

Okay, so then all the amps that I've been looking at are ruled out. Your advice has been more than helpful, now I know how powerful these tube amps are, which was a big question mark for me in the beginning, not knowing how loud they are, so you've just saved me from burning $1k

Thanks alot for your help!
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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 02:06 PM
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

Well I didn't get them all overnight... That's 25 years worth of accumulation and experimentation there my friend...

Yeah people used to be blown away... I would practice with my band using an Orange Tiny Terror (15w) through a Marshall 410 can and it was easily loud enough to keep up with a full live 5-pc metal band. In fact, it meshed fine volume-wise with my rhythm gutarist's 120w half stack. Tube amps are awesome! But they have dramatically different tones. The Orange I just mentioned has a very loose distortion similar to early 70's hard rock (Sabbath tone comes to mind) so while it's a great little amp it isn't really very "metal", especially by modern standards. I rarely play it anymore. In fact my primary gigging rig is my original 1st gen 5150!

But yeah, sometimes when you're trying to figure out what to buy, figuring out what NOT to buy is just as important. It sounds like your current situation will not allow you to really get the most out of a nice high end tube amp, so why blow the money? Save it for when you have a band or a studio where you can blast and THEN pick up that sweet tube goodness!
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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 04:38 PM
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

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Great thanks, but do you have any other suggestions?
Yes, but it may not be possible for you in India. Recently I got a Rocktron Prophesy, Rocktron Velocity 300 and a Marshall 1960 4x12 all for $900. I can play any tone at any volume. This thing is professional rack gear and my sound has improved 100%. I am amazed how well I sound now at any volume and can achieve any tone I want. I should have done this long ago and recommend this to anyone. It cannot be beat. I enjoy playing so much more now.
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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 06:31 PM
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

Go get yourself a Blackstar HT-5. This amp sounds fantastic at low and high volumes. It's (only) 5 watts, but it can get very loud if you want. If you absolutely need cleans at high volumes, and don't want to use your guitar's volume controls to get there find yourself a Blackstar HT-20. It's a 20 watt amp, and will be more than capable of loud cleans, as well as high gain.
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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-13-2012, 10:31 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Need help buying a good amplifier for metal

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Originally Posted by chrisf View Post
Yes, but it may not be possible for you in India. Recently I got a Rocktron Prophesy, Rocktron Velocity 300 and a Marshall 1960 4x12 all for $900. I can play any tone at any volume. This thing is professional rack gear and my sound has improved 100%. I am amazed how well I sound now at any volume and can achieve any tone I want. I should have done this long ago and recommend this to anyone. It cannot be beat. I enjoy playing so much more now.

Well, you are right, none of those Rocktron stuff are available here *sigh* [hate this country] thanks for the input though.
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