Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad. - Jemsite
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 01:18 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: South Jordan, UT
Posts: 183
Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

I just bought a Mesa Nomad 45 over the weekend and have discovered that my effects pedals aren't taking too well to it. My 535Q doesn't sound as pronounced as it did on my old amp and my Whammy doesn't sound as strong as it once did in its harmonization mode. When in the pitch shifting mode it sounds almost as if it is harmonized when set 2 octaves up, the delay is also weaker even with the pedal's volume maxed. The phaser doesn't sound shimmery sweet, rather, it boosts the volume considerably and sounds awful...almost gurgly. It's probably just some stupid mistake on my part but I'd really appreciate if you guys can diagnose the problem.

My set up is as follows:

Guitar -> Boss DS-1 -> Crybaby 535Q Wah -> front input jack

Effects loop send -> Digitech Whammy -> Crybaby GCB-95 Wah -> MXR Phase 90 -> Boss DD-2 Delay -> Effects loop return

I know this amp has an FX Volume control; I have it set to 100%.

Any help is greatly appreciated, thanks.
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 06:22 AM
 
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Location: Leeds, UK - San Antonio, TX
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Heya,

Cant talk long so i'll blast though this, part of the problem could be just needing to adjust to the sound of a new setup.

Other things include setting the FX Mix control on the amp to as close to 10% as possible, this is recommended in the manual as it keeps the signal much stronger and clearer this way.

COuple of other things to mention are that i'd definatley have the whammy in front of the amp before you go into the wah or ds-1 its definatley a PROCESSING device as apposed to a send return device.

Umm i always found that my DS-1 didnt suit the nomad, most likley cause of how much gain the nomad has on tap it doesn't really needed more, i find that subtler overdrive pedals work much better with it for a bit more juice in the leads and crunching up the clean channel SRV style..I managed to get a great made in a japan example of a ds-1 which was great on its own but again wasn't that much better with the nomad.

Your setup isn't too far off of mine (nomad, pedals etc) and i think my tone rocks big time, well i'm happy with it anyway lol try out some of these things and get back to me, if this isn't the caus then it couild well be you need to adjust to the amp. Mesa amps and the nomad in particular take a while to dial in the sound but when you got used to it man its amazing

take it easy gotta run

David
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 11:26 AM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Yeah, it sounds like you're overdriving the FX loop to me. The wah and whammy should probably be out front (definitely the wah, and while I've had no experience with a whammy, I'd imagine it tracks better pre-gain than post).

Keep in mind, also, that the channel volumes function as FX sends, so some experimentation here might be in order. (of course, they also have a powerful effect on tone-shaping, to my ears- if you push the channel volume and back off the master, the tone is much darker and more compressed to my ears than if you keep the channel low and master higher, which, imo, sounds awesome. )

-D
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 10:02 PM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

I got a 535QC and i find that my Nomad 100 head takes away alot as well, for distortion I don't even use my pedals, they add very little. I do not know why this happens with the Nomad series I found it wierd myself and thought I had a faulty. I guess not.
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 11:50 PM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

I agree with Drew and track7, the whammy pedal should be one of the very first things in your chain, and wahs sound crap in an effects loop.

I also think phasers sound better pre-distortion, Van Halen-style, but that's just me.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 11:55 PM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

If it was my rig I'd set it up like this:

Whammy > Crybaby > Other Crybaby > Phaser > DS-1 > amp input

Effect Loop Sent > DD-2 > Effect loop return

The only things I put in my effect loop are a delay, my harmoniser (because unlike the whammy pedal, it DOES work better in the loop, and a BBE Stinger pedal (Sonic Maximizer in pedal form).
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-26-2005, 12:26 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: South Jordan, UT
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Thank you guys so much. I fixed the problem using your advice. Here's my new set up:

Guitar -> 535Q -> DS-1 -> Whammy -> Phaser -> Input

Send -> GCB-95 -> DD-2 -> Return

I kept the cheap wah in the effects loop to get that Tom Morello wah sound ala Bulls On Parade.

I really appreciate the help.
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-26-2005, 12:45 AM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Cool
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2005, 01:55 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Sorry to bug you guys again but the Whammy sounds good when in pitch shifting mode in the front input of the amp but sounds buzzy and static-like in harmonization mode. When it was in the loop, it sound like it was harmonizing but the pitch shifting didn't sound great.

Sorry and thanks again.
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2005, 01:35 PM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Doesn't shock me- try this. Set it to harmonize a perfect fifth. Play a single note. Then shut it off and actually play a perfect fifth (make sure you're perfectly in tune first). They should sound almost exactly the same, right?

Notes played in harmony going into a distorted amp tend to "beat" against each other a little bit. This is normal- notice how it does it when you're physically playing the harmonies. By putting it into the effects loop, it harmonizes post gain and gives you the illusion of double tracked ahrmony being played by seperate guitars, which is probably the sound you're looking for.

Basically, you have two options- sacrifice harmonies for accurate pitch shifting, or sacrifice accurate pitch shifting for harmonies, whichever you find yourself needing the most. Alternately, you could move the Whammy from pre-preamp to FX loop when you go from a song that needs whammy shifting to harmonization (as I don't believe you can do this on the fly anyway on the pedal), or just pick up a seperate harmonizer or another whammy.

-D

(This is why I'm essentially a "straight into the amp" sorta guy- basically, the nomad doesn' need much to make it sound good. I'd love to pick up a good rackmount delay for a little light ambience on leads and looping capabilities, but that's about it, aside from an occasional wah or something)
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-28-2005, 08:46 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Darn, I had a feeling that'd be the choice I had to make. Other than that little annoyance, I'm very happy with the amp and very appreciative of the quick and accurate advice.

Thanks
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-29-2005, 11:22 PM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by track7
...i find that subtler overdrive pedals work much better with it for a bit more juice in the leads and crunching up the clean channel SRV style...
i do the exact same thing. my ART XtremePlus has 3 amp models on it, and i run one of the subtler ones. it really fills out the sound, especially at bedroom levels.

i actually played around with my wah in the FX loop on my Nomad. it sounded pretty cool, but lacked attack, so i put it back infront. i'm getting a flanger pedal in the mail shortly, i may try sticking that into the FX loop.

though, the manual says to not put any FX pedals into the FX loop. anyone know if it will harm the pedal? or the amp for that matter?
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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-31-2005, 01:23 AM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Just put the whammy first in the chain, before any other effects. Treat it like part of your guitar. The tone you will get out of it in harmony mode should be similar to Vai in "The Blood And The Tears". It won't really sound like a $4000 Eventide.
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-31-2005, 01:36 AM
 
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Re: Problems with effects pedals on a Mesa Nomad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wildealien
though, the manual says to not put any FX pedals into the FX loop.
Hmm....?
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amp input , digitech whammy , mesa amps , mesa nomad , mxr phase , overdrive pedal , pitch shifting , sonic maximizer , tom morello , van halen , whammy pedal

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