Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help - Jemsite
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-10-2017, 10:11 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
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Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Hi everyone, I'm about to start a project on my Japanese '93. RG 470. The stock pickups were changed to Evolution neck and bridge with True Velvet single coil. Now I have ordered the V-Treb treble bleed circuit for it, and I want to split the neck pickup using the 500k push-pull pot on volume with treble bleed. But - with treble bleed engaged in both push-pull pot positions. Now is that possible, though I use the neck humbucker very rarely I would like to have a treble bleed in full humbucker and in the split coil mode too?
Any advice with a schematic would be much appreciated!
So wiring should be like this:

5-way switch with push - pull volume-when pushed down (or off)

-Neck humbucker
-Splitted neck + middle single RW/RP
-Middle only - I don't ever use it
-Middle + splitted bridge humbucker
- Bridge humbucker full.

There is one more thing, for more Strat-like sound, should I use inner or outer splitted coils?

Now, all I need when the PP pot is ON is the neck and bridge coil split, everything else unchanged. Plus the treble bleed working in both PP modes.
This should be simple but I'm not very experienced in wiring and I want to make it right... If anyone finds a corresponding diagram, please post it here, thank you!
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 01:45 PM
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Well, for a traditional Strat "in between" sound, you definitely want the inner pickups, the coils closest to the singlecoil. Note that you probably need a RWRP middle pickup to get these to hum cancel appropriately, though more likely than not if you bought a middle True Velvet, that's what you have.

That said - I'm confused by a few things here.

1) You seem to want the treble bleed engaged in all settings, and not bypassable using a push/pull. So, is there any reason you can't use a push/pull tone, rather than volume, and pull the tone knob to split pickups?
2) If these are the positions you want when the push/pull is engaged, what do you want when it's not, then? Neck, then unsplit neck and middle single, middle only, middle and unsplit bridge, and bridge? Or are these sounds you don't want (and the full humbucker combined with singlecoil sounds would be pretty weird), but you just want to be able to split the coils so you can get the 2nd and 4th positions you describe above? If the latter, then you don't even need a push/pull to get there, that's pretty standard Ibanez wiring.

If you DON'T need the positons I'm describing above (a full humbucker and RWRP single), then your standard HSH Ibanexz RG wiring diagram will work. You can grab that off the Ibanez website.
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 02:50 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Hi, Drew, thanks for responding.
When the push/pull pot is NOT engaged
I want the standard Ibanez wiring, like it is now. Yes, the True Velvet is RW/RP, so that is ok.
For the 5 way switch positions the list above is exactly what I want, only for split neck I need the coil split via push /pull pot.
And as for treble bleed, I just wanted to make sure that IT IS working in ALL modes, push/pull pot engaged or not. I'm not experienced in wiring but it will be working, logically, because split or no split, the signal path goes through the volume pot last. And that's the place to put the treble bleed so it will be working.
And yes, the push/pull pot is somehow most convenient to be the volume pot.
So, in split mode I use the coil closer to middle pickup? Ok, that's it then.
Thanks again!
Oh, one more thing, knowing that in standard Ibanez wiring I already have split neck + middle in position 4 the coil split would be in position 5 (push/pull engaged)

Last edited by Ivan75; 12-11-2017 at 03:26 PM.
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 09:50 PM
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

here is the coil tap part of the wiring. Ignore the 3 way switch.






Here is the high pass cap, i recommend anything under .0001 uf or 1000 pico farads, it is also labeled as a 1 meg pot, that part really doesn't matter either. The value of the pot does change the sound, but the high pass cap goes the same way for any pot regardless of it's value.

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Last edited by j.arledge; 12-11-2017 at 09:55 PM.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 09:58 PM
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

i should also clarify the push pull part.

You may need to reverse your green and red wires as hot and ground in order to "short" which half of the pickup you want off when the coil tap is engaged.
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 10:10 PM Thread Starter
 
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Hey, thanks for the diagram and the treble bleed I intend to use is the V-treb, it is the adjustable module
https://www.google.rs/search?client=...okOj6kShs8e2M:

Last edited by Ivan75; 12-11-2017 at 10:38 PM.
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 10:40 PM
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan75 View Post
Hey, thanks for the diagram and the treble bleed I intend to use is the V-treb, it is the adjustable module
https://www.google.rs/search?client=...okOj6kShs8e2M:
cool, that is good idea. I am not sure it can be patented, electronics by nature can't be because the same circuit can used in multiple applications. Either way, cool.
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-12-2017, 06:48 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Yes, here is the link


Thanks again for the advice and diagrams, it seems way easier then I thougt
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-12-2017, 01:28 PM
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Wait, don't pick up the soldering iron just yet.

The diagram j.arledge posted is for H-H where in one position you get neck, neck/bridge, and bridge, while in the other you get neck split, neck/mid split, and bridge. This will NOT work with a middle singlecoil, and you'll need a five way switch anyway so it's only of limited use to you anyway.

Now, I'll admit that "standard" Ibanez wiring has changed a little over the years and from model to model... But, basically, what you're describing IS standard RG wiring, for a modern RG:

Electric Guitars RG - RG655M Prestige | Ibanez guitars

Diagram: http://www2.ibanez.com/supportResour...07/RG2570E.pdf

A standard RG will already have a treble bleed cap installed on the treble knob, in this case it's the 330pF capacitor and (I suspect) all you'll need to do is replace that with your V-treb thing.

But, for what you're looking to do... The standard Ibanez wiring will get you there, there's absolutely no need to add a push-pull knob to the volume. Standard wiring already does exactly what you need.

EDIT - oh, gotcha - you want what you wrote out as "normal" wiring, but you also want to be able to split the neck and bridge to give you singlecoil sounds in position 1 and 5, as well. Hmm...

This looks like it should work, but it puts the coil split on the tone, not the volume. Is that ok? Only thing you'd need to change is to swap that 330pF cap with your adjustable one.

https://www.image-share.com/upload/1255/287.gif
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-12-2017, 08:52 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

The diagram you posted last is the exact thing I have right now, though I'm not sure about the treble bleed, I sure don't hear any effect of that one. On closing the pot sound gets muddy for sure, so there is no treble bleed. RG it is, '93. RG470. I'll try to find out about that.
This diagram shows what I have now and I need the neck to be split in position 5 - using the push/pull pot on volume. The treble bleed also needs to be on volume. So only thing is the the coil split on 5th.
Thanks for getting into this :-)
I'm having some trouble with finding the exact diagram but I have found one that shows the splitted neck humbucker and the pot which is enough to start on.
And, no, I won't be able to solder anything for maybe even a month, I'm waiting for the treble bleed modules to arrive, the Strat is waiting for it too
EDIT
Look at this. Treble bleed!?!?

The '94. RG470 wiring

My friend worked on soldering the Evos so I haven't seen it, strange, and sure don't hear it...
Maybe over 200EUR spent on new set of PUPs sounds a bit too much for a cheap RG (as far as I know the guitar is about 500-600$ max in the US), but I love it, the neck is JUST FANTASTIC. If I ever order a custom made guitar (I've been thinking about it for some time), it will absolutely have the neck made using this one's exact specs. Taking from quite an experience too, I used to work at the guitar shop, played some Jems, J Customs, modern Prestige RGs... man that neck :-)... Had to have it.

Last edited by Ivan75; 12-12-2017 at 09:24 PM. Reason: Posting a link
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-13-2017, 01:22 PM
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Are you talking about the first diagram, or the second? The first is standard Ibanez wiring, the second is standard Ibanez wiring which appears to coil-tap the neck and bridge position when pulled, which I THINK is what you're trying to do. This diagram: https://www.image-share.com/upload/1255/287.gif

No shame in putting $200 of pickups into a 470 - if the guitar sounds and plays well, then go for it!
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-13-2017, 02:50 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Yes, this is it, but I will put the switch on volume
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-06-2018, 11:45 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew View Post
Are you talking about the first diagram, or the second? The first is standard Ibanez wiring, the second is standard Ibanez wiring which appears to coil-tap the neck and bridge position when pulled, which I THINK is what you're trying to do. This diagram: https://www.image-share.com/upload/1255/287.gif

No shame in putting $200 of pickups into a 470 - if the guitar sounds and plays well, then go for it!
Drew, can you please adapt this diagram so that the push/pull is on the volume? You or anyone else...Just can't seem to concentrate and I'm afraid of burning the pot if solder it wrong to many times...
Thanks!!!
I have finally did it but the wrong way, split neck is on closed, not pulled up pot, volume doesn't go quiet (no silence)on closed volume and got some noise that wasn't there before. Need to correct all that.
As for the diagram with push/pull on tone,
to have it other way around, could I just move the the tone cap to volume pot and vice versa on the diagram? What more should I do to make the volume with push/pull, not the tone pot?

Last edited by Ivan75; 02-06-2018 at 09:51 PM.
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-07-2018, 07:47 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Ok I did it. First of all I'd like to thank everyone who helped me with this! I decided to leave it the way it's on the diagram, push/pull on tone. Just for the record again, it's Evolution neck and bridge with DiMarzio True Velvet RWRP in the middle. Volume pot is a bit loose, tone pot is smoother and feels better, but they both work nice.

Well on the sound I've got, first of, neck is split to active outer coil, 2nd position is also outer neck+rwrp middle but the bridge is split to active inner coil. I think this is exactly what I would choose, not too bright on split bridge and just about enough bright in neck. I mean overdriven/heavy distorted sound. Clean is good enough in both position 1 and 2 but, as expected a bit thin and quiet and not even remotely solid as a Strat would be. Maybe using it in a separate amp channel is the best way to get the most out of it. Can't try that, right now, my Laney needs some serious service. Anyways, what I really like is split outer neck heavily overdriven /distorted. Overall of much better use with distortion.

Now I'm waiting for the black 3ply pickguard to arrive, knobs are replaced with black plastic... Thanks again all of you!
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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-11-2018, 07:24 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Push-pull vol pot with treble bleed help

Job done.
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File Type: jpg 20181112_011018.jpg (3.79 MB, 8 views)
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