haha

Well I like mostly cheaper guitars, easier for me to justify tearing them up and modding them.

I just cant see myself spending that kinda money on something I have to change to get it the way I like it.

what does this mean? absolutly nothing Im an idiot and im just ramblin.

 

It's just hard to justify some of the prices you see. I mean it's just a guitar right?

 

It's just hard to justify some of the prices you see. I mean it's just a guitar right?

yeah , that is the way i see it . I anyone can find a guitar that they will like for under 1500, whether it is US made or if it is an import .

all these 3,000 and 4,000$ guitars are overpriced because your paying for a name , the guitar is good and all but the name on the guitar tacks on about a grand more then the guitars should be .

 

yeah , that is the way i see it . I anyone can find a guitar that they will like for under 1500, whether it is US made or if it is an import .

all these 3,000 and 4,000$ guitars are overpriced because your paying for a name , the guitar is good and all but the name on the guitar tacks on about a grand more then the guitars should be .

Well I don't hear anyone complaining about the prices of JEM10's, DNA's or the original Satrianis with graphics just to mention a few!!! Guitars are worth what people are willing to pay for them period!!!

 

Well I don't hear anyone complaining about the prices of JEM10's, DNA's or the original Satrianis with graphics just to mention a few!!! Guitars are worth what people are willing to pay for them period!!!

yeah i know people pay for them , i just dont know why people pay for them . I am never going to buy a new jem or js . a used js1000 for around 780-850 would be fine but i am not spending 2,000 or even 1400 for a new or used jem .

 

Pricing has a lot to do with target market. Nobody is targetting the minimum wage burger flipper, or the $14/hr assembly line grunt, with PRS Private Stocks at $8000 per. The price of your toys has more to do with your economic strata than anything else, and you shouldn;'t be amazed at the amount of disposible income getting thrown around in this world. If there's any doubt have a look at the houses they're currently building in your county!

 

I justify it by how long it will be used.

You spend 200 on a cheap guitar its only going to last until you realise that there are better sounding guitars out there.

I can easily justify buying a PRS custom because I know it will be with me for life (unless I sell it). You pay for what country its build in as well, like rich said the people who build PRS are some of the best there are.

 

Well, it runs even a little deeper than that - people who build guitars are trained, specialised (hopefully professional) people - you would kind of hope that they get paid pretty well for what they do - maybe not as much as a doctor or a dentist, but you'd like to think that the dudes in Nashville, or California, or for that matter wherever Ibanez guitars are made, who put your guitar together earn enough for a decent life, and that don't work in some dreadful sweatshop.

So, what you pay for the guitar you buy reflects to a large degree the quality of life that the builders live. I have to assume you'd rather that the people who work at Fender, or Gibson, or PRS can afford to live somewhere better than a tarpaper shack on Tobacco Road - like you yourself would like to I hope, so as a result, you pay for your guitar in US, or Japanese salaries - simple as that.

while there is of course a fairly decent margin in a guitar (that's why a company chooses to build 'em, eh?), the raw materials are getting pretty costly - a AAA Maple top has gone from about $40 worth of wood to $500 - you get the pleasure of paying that increase, somewhere along the way!

Cheers

David

 

My grg isn't overpriced and it played much better than any high end fender

 

Well, it runs even a little deeper than that - people who build guitars are trained, specialised (hopefully professional) people - you would kind of hope that they get paid pretty well for what they do - maybe not as much as a doctor or a dentist, but you'd like to think that the dudes in Nashville, or California, or for that matter wherever Ibanez guitars are made, who put your guitar together earn enough for a decent life, and that don't work in some dreadful sweatshop.

So, what you pay for the guitar you buy reflects to a large degree the quality of life that the builders live. I have to assume you'd rather that the people who work at Fender, or Gibson, or PRS can afford to live somewhere better than a tarpaper shack on Tobacco Road - like you yourself would like to I hope, so as a result, you pay for your guitar in US, or Japanese salaries - simple as that.

while there is of course a fairly decent margin in a guitar (that's why a company chooses to build 'em, eh?), the raw materials are getting pretty costly - a AAA Maple top has gone from about $40 worth of wood to $500 - you get the pleasure of paying that increase, somewhere along the way!

Cheers

David

yeah but the big companies like that buy thier wood in bulk and probably do pretty well on prices .

yeah i am sure that those guys are schooled and trained but how much of that do you think is done by hand ? It makes it easy when you have a CNC or automated router. i am sure there are a few hands on steps and all but technology has made it so that the costs of paying someone to hand make something is gone , computers are cheaper and faster but yet the prices dont exactly reflect that . I suppose since wage rates have gone up so much it evens out because what few workers you do have are probably paid very well .

i dont know , there is more to it then i guess i see but i still wont pay that much for a guitar . the guitar i have now i am totally happy with and i paid 788 shipped for it , i got a hell of a deal and it is total quality . I dont see myself wanting anything more then a used Dean pro which sell for around 750-800.

 

It would be interesting to see the profit margin on one of those $8000.00 PRS's. The only way I can justify a price like that is with a custom builder who turns out a couple of guitars a month and has a long waiting list of customers.

 

or does everyone expect something for nothing?

In alot of cases, you get nothing for alot of something! (cash)

 

In alot of cases, you get nothing for alot of something! (cash)

hahaha perfect turn around there Gex..

And I agree unless those PRS are hand carved which most arent anymore thats why the pre CNC models are worth a hell of alot more. I wouldnt spend it..

Its wood, some metal, and a couple dudes programing a cnc machine.

The only thing probably not done by machine is the finish.

 

I don't like to complain too much, but certain guitars are so overpriced it's insane. Take Charvel, for example. They really are not worth what they cost and I don't understand how they justify the prices, or why anyone is prepared to pay so much for them. I don't really think Ibanez are overpriced, in fact that's one thing that attracted me to Ibanez in the first place -- I know I can get a nicely built guitar that plays well and will last a long time for a reasonable amount of money. Maverick are another brand that look impressive. I have never tried playing one, but from what I have read, they seem like a good deal. But as for a maker like Charvel, they're truly taking the p*ss.

 

It's already been said...

Things are worth what people are willing to pay and that includes guitars

 

I'm actually amazed that the price of most guitars really hasn't changed all that much in 15 yrs while everything else has gone up with inflation. I bought my Kramer Custom Pacer for $1,200 back then.

 

no its just a rip off in england! still some are quite well priced ie; PRS se's (very cool) and Maverick guitars(see other thread) as good as a prestige for 2/3rds of the price

 

Wait, apparently the PRS SE's are made in the Samick factory which leads me to believe those guitars are worth about 50p. I can't speak on Mavericks though because I've never tried them

 

THis web site is the best for people who think everything is overpriced. Ot basically gives the new price of Vintage gear in it's original amount then converts it to 2000s dollars. For example a 1954 Strat listed at $249.50 in 1954 is equivenlent to $1600.61 in 2000. They don;t list that high now. I'm sure this will open up more Gibson bashing if anyone goes there but here's the link.
http://www.xprt.net/~benboom/ampprices.htm.

 

Yeah. . .$1600 is pretty freakin cheap for a fully handmade, hand crafted work of art, complete with all the mojo that goes with a gutiar made with sweat and blood.


Not a CNC Clone.


And The amps were pretty expensive back then. Welcome to the world of hand-wired, point-to-point amps. Now, its machine-pressed circuitboards all around.

 

Yeah. . .$1600 is pretty freakin cheap for a fully handmade, hand crafted work of art, complete with all the mojo that goes with a gutiar made with sweat and blood.

Not a CNC Clone.

And The amps were pretty expensive back then. Welcome to the world of hand-wired, point-to-point amps. Now, its machine-pressed circuitboards all around.

here is what i found on hand wired point to point amps , verus machine pressed .

This was in response to a post that asked why two different amps from the same maker
of the same model sounded different. This was my response.

It is much less likely today than in the past. Today, 5% resistors and precision caps are much more common and
not as expensive as in the 50s and 60s. The amps of those eras had wide variations in parts. Look at the B+
voltage of 5 Marhall 100 watters of the 60s, and the voltage can range anywhere from the low 400 to 600 volts.

Today there is more consistancy, and whether or not you are a fan of PCBs (printed circuit boards), the fact
remains that PCB's are more consistant, have trace runs that have been optimized for being quiet on CAD
equipment, and they do not absorb moisture like tag board used in the 50s and 60s is prone to do.

A good circuit design implemented with proper mechanical design and assembly, will sound good and be reliable.
Try to listen, for the most part, and don't get too caught up in dialogue.

Marhall and Fender both made amps of wide variation. That is why the same amps of the same model and year
sound different. They did the best they could at the time, and stayed in business, which was their main concern
(and there is no problem with that).

Today you have amps such as Carr Amps ... hand wired, point to point, with all the finest components available.
They are fantastic amplifiers, frankly ... magic. Then you have amps such as Rivera and Bogner ... with mil
grade epoxy PCBs .... great design and construction, and also wonderful amps. The comes along another
thought ... Matchless ... a update of a timeless classic which exceeded the orignal in many ways, and you do not
need to disassemble the entire amp to change tubes either. The Ashdown Pacemaker series of heads ... well, if
you ever saw an original Hiwatt with its mil-spec constuction, Ashdown takes this even further, right to full British
mil-spec for aircraft. Lets not forget THD ... with circuit boards made out of the best glass layup I have ever seen
(and I used to build sailboats out of composite materials) ... his boards are four times thicker than need be ... his
etch work is so thick that a grinder is needed to cut a trace, its all teflon wire and silver solder.

Those are some of the classics of today, but unlike their brothers of the past, they will sound the same when you
pass them down to your grandkids, unlike the Fender and Marshall amps of my generation.

this site has a lot of good info on tube amps .
http://www.guitaramplifierblueprinting.com/pastinfo

 

I think it's only overpriced if it's not your particular bag for the most part.

Although PRS still is overpriced regardless, at least all their really expensive guitars are (which have nothing more to offer than their $2k range guitars at all).

 

here is what i found on hand wired point to point amps , verus machine pressed .

This was in response to a post that asked why two different amps from the same maker
of the same model sounded different. This was my response.

It is much less likely today than in the past. Today, 5% resistors and precision caps are much more common and
not as expensive as in the 50s and 60s. The amps of those eras had wide variations in parts. Look at the B+
voltage of 5 Marhall 100 watters of the 60s, and the voltage can range anywhere from the low 400 to 600 volts.

Today there is more consistancy, and whether or not you are a fan of PCBs (printed circuit boards), the fact
remains that PCB's are more consistant, have trace runs that have been optimized for being quiet on CAD
equipment, and they do not absorb moisture like tag board used in the 50s and 60s is prone to do.

A good circuit design implemented with proper mechanical design and assembly, will sound good and be reliable.
Try to listen, for the most part, and don't get too caught up in dialogue.

Marhall and Fender both made amps of wide variation. That is why the same amps of the same model and year
sound different. They did the best they could at the time, and stayed in business, which was their main concern
(and there is no problem with that).

Today you have amps such as Carr Amps ... hand wired, point to point, with all the finest components available.
They are fantastic amplifiers, frankly ... magic. Then you have amps such as Rivera and Bogner ... with mil
grade epoxy PCBs .... great design and construction, and also wonderful amps. The comes along another
thought ... Matchless ... a update of a timeless classic which exceeded the orignal in many ways, and you do not
need to disassemble the entire amp to change tubes either. The Ashdown Pacemaker series of heads ... well, if
you ever saw an original Hiwatt with its mil-spec constuction, Ashdown takes this even further, right to full British
mil-spec for aircraft. Lets not forget THD ... with circuit boards made out of the best glass layup I have ever seen
(and I used to build sailboats out of composite materials) ... his boards are four times thicker than need be ... his
etch work is so thick that a grinder is needed to cut a trace, its all teflon wire and silver solder.

Those are some of the classics of today, but unlike their brothers of the past, they will sound the same when you
pass them down to your grandkids, unlike the Fender and Marshall amps of my generation.

this site has a lot of good info on tube amps .
http://www.guitaramplifierblueprinting.com/pastinfo

My point being that the amps of old had to be carefully handbuilt, where the ones built on a circuitboard dont require near as many skilled laborers, therefore less money is needed to produce the amps, since a machine is doing all the work. My point isn't about whats better, just why they were more expensive.

I am in no way a point-to-point snob, I dont own any handwired amps, PC board mounted amps (my 2 amps) do me just fine. Im just saying, they were expensive, but then again, you were paying for first class service and a first class product.

 

But CNC machines are expensive, and then there is maintenance..... Hah!