Your friend is correct in one way, but there is a way so that you can have the cake and eat it. It involves making a custom stoprod that is thicker in the middle so it actually touches the block when the trem is in parallel position. I've made a few rods for myself, I have access to a lathe at work.

 

I've been trying to think of a solid fix for this and never thought about making a custom stop rod. What a great idea! Thanks for sharing.

 

http://www.jemsite.com/forums/f16/ngd-and-family-shot-some-mods-129776.html

Check out the pictures in this thread and you'll see what I did.

 

Thanks for your reply and explanations. My friend suggested a similar solution (adding a thin layer of aluminium to the centre of the original stop rod). I guess he is right. I'll think about it as I am not able to do a custom stop rod. Thanks anyway. It's strange that Ibanez hasn't made it fully functional, though.

 

Dude, right?! I have the same situation. And I have a 2550z AND a 3550mz that do the same thing. With the ZPS bar in, the bridge tilts forward, like an original Edge. But with the bar out, I have to tighten the springs using the wheel to counter the string tension to bring the bridge back parallel. Now mind you, I do like the feel better with the ZPS in because of the fact that there's less spring tension and a little of that pull is supported by the ZPS bar when the stop bar is snug against it, but just the fact alone that it's not level irks me so I leave it out...Also I like the flutter effect too much to give it up for a much slinkier feel. I actually tried it tilted forward with the ZPS out and found it's still a bit slinkier and did like it but again, I get finicky about particulars and just changed it back so I could sleep at night lmao. I think I've read in one of the newer Ibanez catalogs that for the EZ bridge with the bar in it can do a small divebomb, but with the bar out it should sit level so they must be aware of it. WHY that is the case? No idea. I've even looked on Ibanezrules (Best Ibanez site ever) to look at pictures of any EZ bridges to see if they tilt forward at least a little but they look pretty much level. I've even had the whole bridge out of the body on both guitars and it's a pretty good even looking piece of hardware so.... The whole thing still leaves me feeling open ended. For now I'm still just leaving the ZPS out. Might as well, it's still a floater and I trick myself into justifying the bridge by thinking "Well, even the J-Customs have em, so they must be good...right?" I Googled the crap out of this issue yesterday so I'm glad you brough it up! Ha

 

The Edge Zero is a superior trem when used without the zps system. But if you care to do the mod I suggested above, it's even a better trem. I have one guitar fully floating and one with a custom stoprod (both fully leveled).

I got nothing bad to say about the Edge-Zero, it's flaw lies in the hit and miss during production and installing of the zps system.

 

I haven't had any real trouble with my ZPS (I have an RG2550MZ and RG1550MZ) and I prefer it in, just because it makes my guitars feel a little different than the OE/LPs and OFR I have. I'll have to look into this more I guess.

 

I agree. I have 2 guitars with Edge Zero trems (RG2550Z and RG3770Z) and you shouldn't have to modify anything - it sounds like you need to spend some more time understanding how to adjust it properly. Don't get hung up on how perfectly parallel the trem is - that will change a bit as you adjust it. Mine aren't perfectly parallel but the action is nice and stop bar is roughly where it should be and they seem to work fine...

 

I've had issues with a couple of my Edge Zero J-Customs in the past, but not with their function. It was more of a case of poor quality parts in the early runs of these. I had a saddle collapse and I had some strange rattles between saddles on another. The good news is that on my 3727 7 string, it is absolutely perfect. No issues. I would have preferred an edge lo pro on that but it works nicely as is.

 

The reason you have the stopbar is to avoid unintentionally flutter and always have a set point where the trem return to after the dive. You can't have this if bar isn't touching the trem. And the trem itself works best when it's leveled.

 

And I'm not telling anybody how they should set up their Edge-Zeros with zps, just stating my opinion about it and what I have done. Each to their own.

 

The angle with ZPS was always an x factor. some are perfect, but only some. Some are negative, some positive. I've always set them up without worrying if the trem was perfectly flat with ZPS in. There are ways to correct, the custom bar as mentioned, or, just wrap your bar with copper shielding tape to the right size, same effect. You can also move the zps spring unit, plug the screw holes, move to correct location, and screw in place. But I've never noticed a problem with trem at angle with zps. The problem with zps was the "flat return from pullup" that had no explanation, or correlation to if the trem was flat or angled.

 

Is this part of the reason why most people take out the ZPS and use the EZ full floating?

 

I wouldn't say most people take it out. People that have use of the zps use it, those that prefer free float remove it.

 

Oh okay. I haven't taken mine out, but hearing about these issues with the zps, I wonder if me setting my bridge at the typically "correct" angle is part of any issues with tuning stability.

BTW, how much extra tension do the ZPS springs provide overall? If I removed the ZPS, how much tension would I lose? It doesn't seem like a lot, but it's one thing I've wondered about.

 

It depends on how hard you preload the block.

 

Do you have a guide to preloading the block on ibanezrules?

 

There is some adjustment of the amount of tension on the trem at the point where it meets the block. Using the thumb wheel adjuster you can add tension (& retune) until the block just barely touches the bar, so it rests very gently against it. At that point you can add more tension with the knob and the bar & block stay in the same place... adding more "preload" to the block. It's surprising how much adjustment it takes to make the block move the stop bar, so the little springs do have a noticeable effect. I adjust mine until it barely contacts the stop bar, then add a turn... so it has very little preload, since the trem feels much stiffer than an Edge already. Just my thoughts on it.. but I've only had one guitar with this setup.

 

I like to add a lot of preload to the block. I keep doing microadjustments loosening the springs until the ZPS bar is virtually held on by just touch with no load. It's gives the strings a wicked slinky feel. I'm with the camp that the angle of the trem with the ZPS in is an immaterial issue so long as when the system is out, then you would maintain a parallel with the body. Of course the angle then affects the action so if you want it at a precise measurement of your preference, you adjust it accordingly. A custom stop rod is a wonderful idea especially if you're very particular about the matter, and Rich's idea of moving the spring unit is ingenious. When Rich chimes in, to me it's like a guru speaking lol 'cause I'm forever browsing this dude's page.

 

Here is my take on the zps system. I recently picked up an rg3xxv from rich (great dealings BTW).
First off, I like the zps since I am primarily a hardtail player. The sustain, especially on the higher frets is greatly increased with the bar in.
But I did notice that my tuning was jumping about 10 cents when I would do an up pull. I also had a nasty clunk when I would initially pick up my guitar and use the trem.

It turns out that my trem was slipping out of the poor excuse for a groove on the studs. I ended up installing some edge studs (thanks Rich), so that issue was eliminated. I had to reset the intonation because the grooves on the edge studs are significantly deeper.

The result? The trem is smoother and slinkier! The tuning issues are better, now only going about 4-5 cents. Better. Certainly usable. But not perfect.

Regarding the trem angle when engaged with the zps bar. All Floyd style trems are supposed to have the knife edges set 90 degrees to the studs at rest. When the edge zero's knife edges are set right, the top of the baseplate sits at an angle just like the original edge.

The zps bar is designed to keep the trem in this position.
Transitioning between bar in and bar out requires adjusting the tension of the regular springs, the same way you would if you removed a spring in a strat trem. This is completely normal.
Simply adjust the wheel tighter until the strings pull back to tune and you are done.

Next time I do a string change, I will delve into the tuning issue some more. For now, the spring tension needs to be strong enough that the zps bar snaps back to full rest in it's plastic bracket.

 

The sustain, especially on the higher frets is greatly increased with the bar in.

Hello, interesting what you say. Do you have any numbers on this? I have the edge zero ii-7 string non-ZPS version, and it sustains great in all frets but 23rd-24th, high E. Can you measure the sustain up there in yours?

 

And smth else, about angle : correct angle is needed in order to maintain same radius of the strings in relation to the fretboard. Due to difference in saddle positions for intonation reasons, strings that have saddles adjusted to the right (G, Low E/B) will have a bigger effect under a raised bridge than strings with saddles adjusted to the left (high E, D), which means that the strings will behave as having an inconsistent radius relative to the fretboard, messing up with the string action height.

 

Tinkertoy, thank you for sharing this. Such a sustain increase from 2 seconds to 5 seconds is HUGE. Makes me wanna look into trem setters, stabilizers. I want only to increase sustain on 23-24 frets. Now it is 2 seconds. All else are fine.
OTOH I have *never* experienced such short sustain between 12-15 on any string in every trem guitar I have. I have 2 floyds and one edge zero ii-7 string. Maybe smth else was fishy in yours?

About trem angle, what I say, is that the raise of e.g. G string height is larger than the raise of E string under the same increase of bridge angle. Therefore, we might have same string height for E and G on zero angle, but then witness a larger height on G in comparison to E under some positive angle of the bridge. This happens because the virtual "circle" on which the G string moves along the trem circular movement has larger diameter than the equivalent circle for E. On zero angle, we completely eliminate this effect. Similarly on negative angle, we have the opposite (unwanted) results.

 

That's funny, I've found that my 2550 free floating and higher string height, had better sustain than with the bar in.