hey guys anybody here owns one? i like the iceman giger series 
H.R. Giger series
chi
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Well its pretty easy to get you fired up
Whos next ????
Whos next ????
There is a differance between being an Ibanez enthuisiast and a fan boy.
The fact that you can't differntiate between a entry level and a higher quality guitar shows your lack of guitar knowledge.
I can play cheap guitars too. Though I prefer playing a quality instrument. It makes the expierience more enjoyable and inspiring.
Btw...I'm not one of these guys that just regurgitates what I've read.
I have both korean and japanese gutars of the same series.
![Image]()
I base what I say on my expieriance with each. Though I have learned quite a bit from the other forum members here.
But hey, if you enjoy the "lesser" models, good for you. You saved yourself alot of money. I kinda wish I was that easy to please.
The fact that you can't differntiate between a entry level and a higher quality guitar shows your lack of guitar knowledge.
I can play cheap guitars too. Though I prefer playing a quality instrument. It makes the expierience more enjoyable and inspiring.
Btw...I'm not one of these guys that just regurgitates what I've read.
I have both korean and japanese gutars of the same series.
I base what I say on my expieriance with each. Though I have learned quite a bit from the other forum members here.
But hey, if you enjoy the "lesser" models, good for you. You saved yourself alot of money. I kinda wish I was that easy to please.
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5,806 Posts
you are getting defensive instead of researching and learning.
there have been plenty of threads discussing MIK vs MIJ on this site. if you would like to know the FACTS and not just opinions, do a little research. i'll give you a head start:
your guitar isn't being bagged on saying it is a bad guitar, just that it would be a higher quality instrument had it been built to the MIJ standards (meaning attention to detail and materials used). the MIK is cheaper because: cheaper labor costs, cheaper materials, lowered attention to detail. the Korean luthiers are improving their techniques and that is possibly why Ibanez has moved so much production to Korea: cheaper overhead means more money for them while still maintaining a par quality instrument (par being the optimal word). MIK still uses inferior parts and woods but they do it ON PURPOSE to fill a price point. to say MIJ isn't better is like comparing a Daewoo to a BMW. the Daewoo is built inferior to fill a price point while better craftsmanship/technology and materials are why people pay more for the BMW.
MIK are still good instruments, just not up to par with MIJ build. i own a Prestige MIK and will buy other MIKs (possibly IC400, S2170fw and RGT42dxfx). had the Prestige MIK i own been MIJ i know it would have been even better but waaaay more expensive.
bottom line is the MIK stuff would be better built instruments if they were MIJ due to more attention to detail, better materials used and higher quality parts (Edge Pro vs Edge Pro 2 and 3) but the price you would pay is more than MIK for those important details. again, they are filling a price point.
if you have the chance to compare MIJ w/ MIK side by side and STILL don't know the differentce then this is a moot conversation.
there have been plenty of threads discussing MIK vs MIJ on this site. if you would like to know the FACTS and not just opinions, do a little research. i'll give you a head start:
your guitar isn't being bagged on saying it is a bad guitar, just that it would be a higher quality instrument had it been built to the MIJ standards (meaning attention to detail and materials used). the MIK is cheaper because: cheaper labor costs, cheaper materials, lowered attention to detail. the Korean luthiers are improving their techniques and that is possibly why Ibanez has moved so much production to Korea: cheaper overhead means more money for them while still maintaining a par quality instrument (par being the optimal word). MIK still uses inferior parts and woods but they do it ON PURPOSE to fill a price point. to say MIJ isn't better is like comparing a Daewoo to a BMW. the Daewoo is built inferior to fill a price point while better craftsmanship/technology and materials are why people pay more for the BMW.
MIK are still good instruments, just not up to par with MIJ build. i own a Prestige MIK and will buy other MIKs (possibly IC400, S2170fw and RGT42dxfx). had the Prestige MIK i own been MIJ i know it would have been even better but waaaay more expensive.
bottom line is the MIK stuff would be better built instruments if they were MIJ due to more attention to detail, better materials used and higher quality parts (Edge Pro vs Edge Pro 2 and 3) but the price you would pay is more than MIK for those important details. again, they are filling a price point.
if you have the chance to compare MIJ w/ MIK side by side and STILL don't know the differentce then this is a moot conversation.
Oh please - listen to the people comment on this forum about the Giger when they themselves own guitars with patterns of Vai's old drapes - now that's ugly, or neon 80's pink guitars suitable really only for their sister. Get over yourselves, a decent guitar is all in the opinion of the player.
By the way - luthiers don't build these Ibanez guitars - CNC machines do....It's all in the setup.
By the way - luthiers don't build these Ibanez guitars - CNC machines do....It's all in the setup.
Grandma's sofa looks cool when the player can carry it off well. If you look like s**t holding a 77FP, that's your problem. Go buy a bland, black guitar and be happy.
Pretty sharp coming from someone with "Vai" in their JEMsite forum name. :roll:
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People that don't know anything about manufacturing should never state things like they do.
The body and neck are cut and shaped by CNC, and that is the end of any automated process. You think they have a little team of Sony robot dogs with little files for toe nails and sandpaper paws, that shoot paint out their ass?! :lol:
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1,020 Posts
Yeah, I'd like an Iceman giger too.
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2,164 Posts
Nice!
C'mon guys, you can't deteriorate the argument into "Oh yeah? Well your MIJ guitars look stupid!" The paint or design is irrelevant to build quality. Screamndemon69 had it exactly right. The MIK guitars are less expensive because of where they're built and the materials that go into them. If they were just as quality as the MIJ, they'd cost the same. That's not a put-down, it's not personal opinion, it's just economics.
Much of a guitar's playability IS setup, and I'm sure you can get any of the MIK guitars to play really well if you take the time. But there is a difference in the GRADE of materials and hardware.
If you're happy with your MIK axe, then that's great, and who cares what someone else thinks. But don't think that making fun of SK's and FP's is going to help the credibility of your argument. If the Gigers have anywhere near the collectibility of the SK/FP in 20 years, I'll eat my hat (Spawn RG320 anyone?).
Oh here we go - GOD SPEAKS --- so you claim to have insite into what I know -Whatever!! How about a big SHUTUP!!!
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4,312 Posts
Ahh good to see that both sides are getting a fair say in all of this.
My point has been proven "The Ibanez giger series may not be of the high standard of quality that comes from Japan but they are still good guitars to play and when setup properly with new PUPS, they can be a mean guitar in their own right."
Side by Side
My RG550
![Image]()
![Image]()
and my Giger have obvious differences. But as far as playing goes they each have there own strengths and weaknesses. And sound differences
My good mate recently bought an electric guitar. Its a peice of ****, he paid $100 for it. I tuned it for him and started giving him lessons, and once I got used to the guitar, I could feel for its strengths and weaknesses and adapted to it and got some good sounds from it. Its all in the player and not the guitar.
Brian May started out with a guitar him and his father made. And he used it for most of his career, and he sounded awesome and never used a $4000 Jem to sound good. Then spent the rest of his career having his tech guys copy his original guitar and homemade pickups to reproduce his original guitar. Its all in the playing
Can someone explain to me why Ibanez Japan would not employ the same guitar building techniques in their Korea factory? Did the Korea factory open up as a seperate entity and decide to learn how to build Ibanez guitars or was it setup by Ibanez japan etc...
It seems to me that they would use some Ibanez know how if they were going to build Ibanez guitars for the mass market and badge them as Ibanez. Im not saying that their attention to details is as good as the japanese, and maybe the Korean grown trees are inferior to Japanese trees, hence the wood is not as good etc... But I would bet that the techniques in Korea arnt that different to the Japanese factory
They must have some skills....???
My point has been proven "The Ibanez giger series may not be of the high standard of quality that comes from Japan but they are still good guitars to play and when setup properly with new PUPS, they can be a mean guitar in their own right."
Side by Side
My RG550
My good mate recently bought an electric guitar. Its a peice of ****, he paid $100 for it. I tuned it for him and started giving him lessons, and once I got used to the guitar, I could feel for its strengths and weaknesses and adapted to it and got some good sounds from it. Its all in the player and not the guitar.
Brian May started out with a guitar him and his father made. And he used it for most of his career, and he sounded awesome and never used a $4000 Jem to sound good. Then spent the rest of his career having his tech guys copy his original guitar and homemade pickups to reproduce his original guitar. Its all in the playing
Can someone explain to me why Ibanez Japan would not employ the same guitar building techniques in their Korea factory? Did the Korea factory open up as a seperate entity and decide to learn how to build Ibanez guitars or was it setup by Ibanez japan etc...
It seems to me that they would use some Ibanez know how if they were going to build Ibanez guitars for the mass market and badge them as Ibanez. Im not saying that their attention to details is as good as the japanese, and maybe the Korean grown trees are inferior to Japanese trees, hence the wood is not as good etc... But I would bet that the techniques in Korea arnt that different to the Japanese factory
They must have some skills....???
Please. :roll:
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772 Posts
where in my posts are massive amounts of exclamation marks and angry smilies?
how am i getting fired up?
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2,164 Posts
Freak,
Well, you're almost there. You agree that the materials that go into the MIK guitars may not be the same quality as the MIJ's, and that the attention to finishing details may not be the same. I think that's pretty much the points of the people you're arguing with here. And of course Ibanez is involved with the manufacture of their guitars outside Japan.
But your suggestion that a $100 guitar will perform the same as a $2,000 is ludicrous. Of course the player makes a difference - I mean, Paul Gilbert is going to be a good player no matter what he's on, whether it's a custom PGM or a pawn shop Hondo. But the sound that comes out of the Hondo, whether it's set up or not, is going to be ass compared to what the PGM is capable of. Then there's the matter of expression. Is he going to find it easier to eek out the finest nuances and emotion of his playing with a guitar he has to put more effort into playing to start with? Or will it sound more like PG if he doesn't have to worry about the setup, the level frets, the extra power of the pickups for harmonics and crunch, the dependability of the whammy to return to pitch (ok, maybe not a PGM, but you get the idea)?
Now to follow your argument, all of that could be solved if you set the Hondo up properly. Well, by doing what? Doing a fret job? Adjusting the neck? Setting the action nice and low? Well, that's going to help, but on a cheapo guitar, that's going to last about five minutes before the thing goes out of tune or needs adjusting again. If you suggest that upgrading pickups or hardware will make a difference, then you're just making my argument valid. All of the things (or many of them) that you would need to do to a cheap guitar to make it really playable (outside of your living room through your headphone amp) are usually standard on a quality, high end guitar. That's why they cost more. Maybe you know how to do your own setups, but it costs non-tech types money for that. Money they could have spent for a decent guitar in the first place.
I'm sorry, but the statement about how the guitar itself is irrelevant and the sound is completely due to the player is absolute crap. The SKILL of the playing IS up to the player, and can often overcome the lack of playability of a lesser guitar. But if you actually believe that a department-store guitar is capable of producing the same tone quality and spectrum of sound as a Jem, J-Custom, Gibson Les Paul, ESP Custom, EC Strat, or any other premium guitar, then you seriously need to get your ears checked. No offense intended.
As for the Giger guitar, it's a pretty good axe for the money, and I'm not tearing it down. Hell, I do like the graphic. And maybe Brian May's dad really know how to build good guitars (or are you assuming that it was a POS?). Or maybe it's just what you're used to. You like what you like, and you play what you've got, whatever that is, and more power to you. But don't be irrational just because you feel like you have to be defensive. If you're happy with what you've got, then to hell with everyone else and play the crap out of that Hondo, dammit! But don't tell me the earth is flat while you're doing it.
Well, you're almost there. You agree that the materials that go into the MIK guitars may not be the same quality as the MIJ's, and that the attention to finishing details may not be the same. I think that's pretty much the points of the people you're arguing with here. And of course Ibanez is involved with the manufacture of their guitars outside Japan.
But your suggestion that a $100 guitar will perform the same as a $2,000 is ludicrous. Of course the player makes a difference - I mean, Paul Gilbert is going to be a good player no matter what he's on, whether it's a custom PGM or a pawn shop Hondo. But the sound that comes out of the Hondo, whether it's set up or not, is going to be ass compared to what the PGM is capable of. Then there's the matter of expression. Is he going to find it easier to eek out the finest nuances and emotion of his playing with a guitar he has to put more effort into playing to start with? Or will it sound more like PG if he doesn't have to worry about the setup, the level frets, the extra power of the pickups for harmonics and crunch, the dependability of the whammy to return to pitch (ok, maybe not a PGM, but you get the idea)?
Now to follow your argument, all of that could be solved if you set the Hondo up properly. Well, by doing what? Doing a fret job? Adjusting the neck? Setting the action nice and low? Well, that's going to help, but on a cheapo guitar, that's going to last about five minutes before the thing goes out of tune or needs adjusting again. If you suggest that upgrading pickups or hardware will make a difference, then you're just making my argument valid. All of the things (or many of them) that you would need to do to a cheap guitar to make it really playable (outside of your living room through your headphone amp) are usually standard on a quality, high end guitar. That's why they cost more. Maybe you know how to do your own setups, but it costs non-tech types money for that. Money they could have spent for a decent guitar in the first place.
I'm sorry, but the statement about how the guitar itself is irrelevant and the sound is completely due to the player is absolute crap. The SKILL of the playing IS up to the player, and can often overcome the lack of playability of a lesser guitar. But if you actually believe that a department-store guitar is capable of producing the same tone quality and spectrum of sound as a Jem, J-Custom, Gibson Les Paul, ESP Custom, EC Strat, or any other premium guitar, then you seriously need to get your ears checked. No offense intended.
As for the Giger guitar, it's a pretty good axe for the money, and I'm not tearing it down. Hell, I do like the graphic. And maybe Brian May's dad really know how to build good guitars (or are you assuming that it was a POS?). Or maybe it's just what you're used to. You like what you like, and you play what you've got, whatever that is, and more power to you. But don't be irrational just because you feel like you have to be defensive. If you're happy with what you've got, then to hell with everyone else and play the crap out of that Hondo, dammit! But don't tell me the earth is flat while you're doing it.
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